Discussion:
'The future doesn't hang on one man': why Peres could hold key to road map success
(too old to reply)
Daniel Bernard
2005-04-22 09:03:11 UTC
Permalink
'The future doesn't hang on one man': why Peres could hold key to road
map success

Consensus is essential for peace, says former PM

Chris McGreal in Tel Aviv
Friday April 22, 2005

Guardian

Shimon Peres doesn't like talking about the past. History, the Israeli
vice-premier and Labour party leader says, bores him. "I never think
back. Since I cannot change the past, why should I deal with it? You
have to really deal with the future," he said in an interview with the
Guardian.
Those Israelis who cast the Nobel peace prize winner as one of the
"Oslo criminals" for attempting to make peace with the Palestinians a
decade ago might say he cannot bear to reflect on his failure.

But the octogenarian former prime minister is almost as reluctant to
talk about a not-too-distant future; what Israelis call "the day
after".

Only the very pessimistic - or optimistic for those who share the
views of the hard core of Jewish settlers - now doubt that Ariel
Sharon intends to carry through his "unilateral disengagement plan" to
pull out of the Gaza Strip.

The Israeli prime minister has staked his political future on removing
the 8,000 Jewish settlers living there. The Israeli public
overwhelmingly backs the move as a step toward "separation" from the
Palestinians, and Mr Peres has taken his Labour party into the
government to ensure it goes ahead.

But then what? Is Gaza the beginning of a process that will also see
Israel withdraw from most of the West Bank and the establishment of a
real state for the Palestinians?

Or is it Gaza first and last, as the Palestinians fear, with
disengagement a cover for Mr Sharon to entrench more than 400,000
settlers living in the rest of the occupied territories while
unilaterally imposing the borders of a rump Palestinian homeland that
would remain in Israel's grip?

Mr Sharon is not saying, but Mr Peres may hold the key.

"The only reason I am in the government is the peace process. We don't
have any other reason," he said, adding that the party would leave the
government if Israel halted the peace process.

"One thing I believe is that the future doesn't hang on a single man,
whether he's a prime minister or anybody else. It is the reality and
the climate that are being established after a reaction that creates a
new reality. Clearly it's not the man that decides about reality, it's
the reality that decides about the leader."

By rights, it should be Mr Peres's Labour party that is leading the
charge from Gaza. Under a different leader, the party campaigned in
the general election two years ago on a pledge to unilaterally pull
out of Gaza, and it first proposed building a "security fence" along
the West Bank border. Mr Sharon used to dismiss both measures as a
victory for terrorism.

The prime minister stole the tactics when his support began to ebb,
but the manoeuvre deeply divided his Likud party and now he is forced
to rely on Labour to make his disengagement plan possible.

Mr Peres has come under strong criticism within his own party for
serving under Mr Sharon as his vice-premier, and some Labour members
want him to force an election once the Gaza withdrawal is complete.
But the Labour leader says he will keep the administration afloat so
long as there is a return to the US-led "road map" that Mr Sharon has
declared frozen.

"The day after there will be an extreme difference between us and
Likud. Labour will say go for the road map. Likud will say it too but
only after the Palestinians destroy the infrastructure of terror," he
said. "I see in the road map the expression of a political vision and
I would like to have a full peace and a full agreement."

But Mr Peres is in no great hurry to get there.

"If you have a brilliant plan without a majority or a mediocre plan
with a majority, you have to pay attention to the majority, not to the
brilliance of the proposals," he said.

"And for the first time here there was created a majority ... Not as
perfect as we would like but a working majority. So there must be a
combination of a good plan and a real majority."

Talk of moving slowly makes the Palestinians nervous and suspicious.
They say Israel uses delay to tighten its grip on territory by
creating "new facts on the ground". In the decade after the signing of
the 1993 Oslo accords, Israel doubled the size of Jewish settlements
in the West Bank.

"It seems the Israeli negotiations are on the basis of making peace
among themselves," said the Palestinian chief negotiator, Saeb Erekat.
"My analysis is that Mr Sharon is trying to cancel the third phase of
the road map that specifies Israel has to end the occupation and
negotiate the status of Jerusalem and refugees. Everything I see is
going in that direction."

The Palestinian leadership wants Israel to state clearly that the
final objective is a Palestinian state based on 1967 borders with East
Jerusalem as its capital, with some swapping of territory to take
account of Jewish settlements in and around Jerusalem that it is
widely agreed will inevitably be incorporated into Israel.

Mr Sharon's allies say that even if that is his intent he cannot say
so publicly without inflaming opposition to the withdrawal from Gaza
and provoking a further revolt in his Likud party that might bring
down the government.

Mr Peres doubts that the Israeli public is ready to go that far.

"I'm not sure. I think I would wait on the issue of Jerusalem ... and
also the issue of refugees. These are the two things that may prevent
us from having a majority for the time being," he said.

But others in the Labour party argue for continued unilateral action.

"The day after, there will be no serious negotiations about permanent
status," said a senior Labour MP, Haim Ramon. "I believe the next step
should be Disengagement 2, where we go back and repeat that we do not
want to rule that area [the West Bank] ... The public in general is
ripe to leave the rest of the territories."

But Mr Erekat suspects that the reason Mr Sharon remains silent is
that he has no intention either of negotiating or of adhering to the
1967 borders. He believes that disengagement, along with the "security
fence" and continued settlement expansion, is part of the Israeli
prime minister's strategy to dictate the borders of a rump Palestinian
state.

So is Mr Peres confident that, after the pullout from Gaza is
complete, Mr Sharon will return to the road map and negotiate a
settlement?

"I don't have a reason to deny what the prime minister says but I
believe a combination of what he said and what is happening on the
ground will really push all of us to continue the peace process," he
said.

"You can't stop it. If you reach the middle of the lake and you feel
tired, don't swim back."
--
amicalement,

Daniel
JBgarbuz
2005-04-28 15:13:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Daniel Bernard
"It seems the Israeli negotiations are on the basis of making peace
among themselves," said the Palestinian chief negotiator, Saeb Erekat.
"My analysis is that Mr Sharon is trying to cancel the third phase of
the road map that specifies Israel has to end the occupation and
negotiate the status of Jerusalem and refugees. Everything I see is
going in that direction."<
I am for the peace process, but if the Palestinians are going
to remain obstinate about splitting Jerusalem to take
part as their capital, or still keep talking about some "right of return" of
"refugees" to ISrael, or about some return to the mythical "1967 border"
then I am certain there will never be a Palestinian state and the territory
will remain under Israeli "occupation." They have to decide if they
really want a state or not, or just to blame ISrael because it refuses
to sue for peace like a defeated state. Israel will NOT be the
ONLY state in the world with a split capital. If the Palestinians
are not prepared to ever accept 93% of the West Bank minus
Jerusalem in a demilitarized, friendly state next to Israel, then
they will have no state at all. And this is what Israel should make
completely clear to them with no ambiguities. It's either that
or nothing, and ongoing occupation, if that is what they prefer.
Post by Daniel Bernard
The Palestinian leadership wants Israel to state clearly that the
final objective is a Palestinian state based on 1967 borders with East
Jerusalem as its capital, with some swapping of territory to take
account of Jewish settlements in and around Jerusalem that it is
widely agreed will inevitably be incorporated into Israel.<
And we are waiting for the Palestinians to state that they are prepared
to accept a demilitarized state which will include 93% of the West
Bank and 100% of Gaza, but which will definitely NOT include
any part of Jerusalem, nor any "return" of Arab "refugees"
to the State of Israel. This is what Sharon should be unambiguously
telling the ARabs so that they do not hold on to pipe dreams. Unless
they prefer their pipe dreams to an actual state.
Post by Daniel Bernard
Mr Peres doubts that the Israeli public is ready to go that far.
"I'm not sure. I think I would wait on the issue of Jerusalem ... and
also the issue of refugees. These are the two things that may prevent
us from having a majority for the time being," he said.
Finally, Peres is starting to make some sense after many decades
of double talk. JErusalem, "right of return" and so called "'67
borders" are definite deal-killers, and the Palestinians will never
have a state if this is the line they will not be moved from.
ISrael is not a defeated nation that has to sue for peace like
Japan or Germany after WWII.
A***@hotmail.com
2005-04-28 18:46:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by JBgarbuz
Post by Daniel Bernard
"It seems the Israeli negotiations are on the basis of making peace
Among themselves," said the Palestinian chief negotiator, Saeb
Erekat.
Post by JBgarbuz
Post by Daniel Bernard
"My analysis is that Mr Sharon is trying to cancel the third phase of
the road map that specifies Israel has to end the occupation and
Negotiate the status of Jerusalem and refugees. Everything I see is
going in that direction."<
I am for the peace process, but if the Palestinians are going
to remain obstinate about splitting Jerusalem to take
part as their capital, or still keep talking about some "right of return" of
"refugees" to ISrael, or about some return to the mythical "1967 border"
then I am certain there will never be a Palestinian state and the territory
will remain under Israeli "occupation." They have to decide if they
really want a state or not, or just to blame ISrael because it
refuses
Post by JBgarbuz
to sue for peace like a defeated state. Israel will NOT be the
ONLY state in the world with a split capital. If the Palestinians
are not prepared to ever accept 93% of the West Bank minus
Jerusalem in a demilitarized, friendly state next to Israel, then
they will have no state at all. And this is what Israel should make
completely clear to them with no ambiguities. It's either that
or nothing, and ongoing occupation, if that is what they prefer.
You will have to get used to East Jerusalem as being the Palestinian
Capital as that is going to be the end result of final negotiation.
The 1967 border is the border that the entire world, including the US
sees as Israel legal border, so you will also have to get used to that
as well. Not even the US recognizes Israel's claim to Jerusalem as its
capital, as proven by the US embassy being in Israel's capital of Tel
Aviv. Israel is in no position to dictate to anyone, as it is already
in violation of the UN Security Council and could be crushed
economically if sanctions were imposed upon it. So Israel will do what
it is told and remove its illegal settlements and army from all lands
occupied during its 1967 attack upon it neighbors and abide by the
wishes of the world, or it will become even more of a pariah than it is
today, and the worlds Jews will never be able to walk the streets in
safety.
Post by JBgarbuz
Post by Daniel Bernard
The Palestinian leadership wants Israel to state clearly that the
final objective is a Palestinian state based on 1967 borders with East
Jerusalem as its capital, with some swapping of territory to take
account of Jewish settlements in and around Jerusalem that it is
widely agreed will inevitably be incorporated into Israel.<
And we are waiting for the Palestinians to state that they are
prepared
Post by JBgarbuz
to accept a demilitarized state which will include 93% of the West
Bank and 100% of Gaza, but which will definitely NOT include
any part of Jerusalem, nor any "return" of Arab "refugees"
to the State of Israel. This is what Sharon should be unambiguously
telling the ARabs so that they do not hold on to pipe dreams. Unless
they prefer their pipe dreams to an actual state.
Like I said, the Israeli regime is in no position to dictate anything.
It will do as instructed and like it, or be destroyed economically due
to its own stupidity by the world. Sharon is a good little puppy who
is already doing as he is told as evident by his constant reversals of
his own positions. He may talk tough, but he is doing exactly what he
is being told he will do.
Post by JBgarbuz
Post by Daniel Bernard
Mr Peres doubts that the Israeli public is ready to go that far.
"I'm not sure. I think I would wait on the issue of Jerusalem ... and
also the issue of refugees. These are the two things that may prevent
us from having a majority for the time being," he said.
Finally, Peres is starting to make some sense after many decades
of double talk. JErusalem, "right of return" and so called "'67
borders" are definite deal-killers, and the Palestinians will never
have a state if this is the line they will not be moved from.
ISrael is not a defeated nation that has to sue for peace like
Japan or Germany after WWII.
The 67 borders are Israel's borders, and while the Palestinians may
allow Israel to trade some land on the Israeli side of those borders
for a few larger illegal settlements that border the 1967 border, all
the remaining settlements in the West Bank will be vacated once the
Gaza pullout is complete. The right of return is guaranteed under
international to the individuals who were denied their right of return,
so that is something that will have to handled by the United Nations
and International Court of Justice as they are not necessarily
represented by the Palestinian Authority.
j***@netzero.com
2005-05-01 13:35:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Daniel Bernard
Post by JBgarbuz
Post by Daniel Bernard
"It seems the Israeli negotiations are on the basis of making peace
Among themselves," said the Palestinian chief negotiator, Saeb
Erekat.
Post by JBgarbuz
Post by Daniel Bernard
"My analysis is that Mr Sharon is trying to cancel the third
phase
Post by Daniel Bernard
of
Post by JBgarbuz
Post by Daniel Bernard
the road map that specifies Israel has to end the occupation and
Negotiate the status of Jerusalem and refugees. Everything I see is
going in that direction."<
I am for the peace process, but if the Palestinians are going
to remain obstinate about splitting Jerusalem to take
part as their capital, or still keep talking about some "right of
return" of
Post by JBgarbuz
"refugees" to ISrael, or about some return to the mythical "1967
border"
Post by JBgarbuz
then I am certain there will never be a Palestinian state and the
territory
Post by JBgarbuz
will remain under Israeli "occupation." They have to decide if they
really want a state or not, or just to blame ISrael because it
refuses
Post by JBgarbuz
to sue for peace like a defeated state. Israel will NOT be the
ONLY state in the world with a split capital. If the Palestinians
are not prepared to ever accept 93% of the West Bank minus
Jerusalem in a demilitarized, friendly state next to Israel, then
they will have no state at all. And this is what Israel should make
completely clear to them with no ambiguities. It's either that
or nothing, and ongoing occupation, if that is what they prefer.
You will have to get used to East Jerusalem as being the Palestinian
Capital as that is going to be the end result of final negotiation.<
I would have supported a minor division of Jerusalem in 2000, at
Camp David. No more. The terror war started again by the Palestinians
took that option off the table. Every time the Arabs resort to war,
Israel will liberate more Jewish territory. Aggressors cannot win by
war or terror. As far as I'm concerned, the redivision of Jeruslem is
now off the table forever. The Arabs will either accept our generous
terms, or face further consequences.
Post by Daniel Bernard
The 1967 border is the border that the entire world,<
I don't care what this mythical "entire world" of yours "thinks," as
you say. There was nothing more than an Armistice in 1949, and the
ARabs refused to make peace and recognize ISrael with the Armistice
line as an international border. And, indeed violated at every
instance. So there is no legal basis to what you say or what this
mythical "entire world" of yours supposedly thinks.
Post by Daniel Bernard
including the US
sees as Israel legal border, so you will also have to get used to
that as well.<

The US does not claim the 1949 Armistice line as the "pre-67" border.
This is just a figure of speech. It has no basis in law, and the US
knows it. THe international border has to be negotiated at the peace
table, as was the border between Egypt and Israel, Jordan and ISrael,
etc. There is no international border until Israel is FULLY recognized,
and such a border is negotiated. There are no borders between
unrecognized states. Israel thought after 1949 that the ARabs would
come around and recognize Israel, but they did not. SO the 1949
Armistice lines are not international borders.
Post by Daniel Bernard
Not even the US recognizes Israel's claim to Jerusalem as its
capital, as proven by the US embassy being in Israel's capital of Tel
Aviv. Israel is in no position to dictate to anyone, as it is already
in violation of the UN Security Council and could be crushed
Post by Daniel Bernard
economically if sanctions were imposed upon it. <
Israel is not in violation of any UN SEcurity COuncil resolution, and
personally I think it is time for ISrael to get a seat on the Security
Council, since the Jewish nation had the most casualties in WWII. Only
nations who contributed to the defeat of the Axis have the right to
claim a seat in the Security Council.
Post by Daniel Bernard
So Israel will do what it is told and remove its illegal settlements
and army from all lands occupied during its 1967 attack upon it
neighbors and abide by the
Post by Daniel Bernard
wishes of the world, or it will become even more of a pariah than it
is today, and the worlds Jews will never be able to walk the streets in
safety.<

Israel will always do what it has to do, and will never give in to any
threats by any or all nations. The JEws don't owe the world any debts.
ISrael produces some of the best arms in the world, and is quite
capable of arming the world Jewish population if it comes to that. The
days when Jews will cower to threats ended on May 14, 1948.
Post by Daniel Bernard
Post by JBgarbuz
Post by Daniel Bernard
The Palestinian leadership wants Israel to state clearly that the
final objective is a Palestinian state based on 1967 borders with
Post by Daniel Bernard
EastJerusalem as its capital, with some swapping of territory to take
account of Jewish settlements in and around Jerusalem that it is
Post by Daniel Bernard
Post by JBgarbuz
Post by Daniel Bernard
widely agreed will inevitably be incorporated into Israel.<
And we are waiting for the Palestinians to state that they are
prepared
Post by JBgarbuz
to accept a demilitarized state which will include 93% of the West
Bank and 100% of Gaza, but which will definitely NOT include
any part of Jerusalem, nor any "return" of Arab "refugees"
to the State of Israel. This is what Sharon should be unambiguously
telling the ARabs so that they do not hold on to pipe dreams. Unless
they prefer their pipe dreams to an actual state.
Like I said, the Israeli regime is in no position to dictate
anything. It will do as instructed and like it, or be destroyed
economically due to its own stupidity by the world. Sharon is a good
little puppy who is already doing as he is told as evident by his
constant reversals of his own positions. He may talk tough, but he is
doing exactly what he is being told he will do.<

You're funny. The US military is almost exhausted in Iraq, and when it
withdraws, there will be no power that could stop ISraeli occupation of
the oil fields if it came to that. Anyone who thinks that Israel gives
into threats has his ass where his brains should be. Israel is not a
banana republic.
Post by Daniel Bernard
Post by JBgarbuz
Post by Daniel Bernard
Mr Peres doubts that the Israeli public is ready to go that far.
"I'm not sure. I think I would wait on the issue of Jerusalem ...
and
Post by JBgarbuz
Post by Daniel Bernard
also the issue of refugees. These are the two things that may
prevent
Post by JBgarbuz
Post by Daniel Bernard
us from having a majority for the time being," he said.
Finally, Peres is starting to make some sense after many decades
of double talk. JErusalem, "right of return" and so called "'67
borders" are definite deal-killers, and the Palestinians will never
have a state if this is the line they will not be moved from.
ISrael is not a defeated nation that has to sue for peace like
Japan or Germany after WWII.
The 67 borders are Israel's borders, and while the Palestinians may
allow Israel to trade some land on the Israeli side of those borders
for a few larger illegal settlements that border the 1967 border, all
the remaining settlements in the West Bank will be vacated once the
Gaza pullout is complete. The right of return is guaranteed under
international to the individuals who were denied their right of return,
so that is something that will have to handled by the United Nations
and International Court of Justice as they are not necessarily
represented by the Palestinian Authority.
Don Ocean
2005-05-01 20:30:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by j***@netzero.com
You're funny. The US military is almost exhausted in Iraq, and when it
withdraws, there will be no power that could stop ISraeli occupation of
the oil fields if it came to that. Anyone who thinks that Israel gives
into threats has his ass where his brains should be. Israel is not a
banana republic.
Your right! Israel is not a banana republic. That shitty little
mercenary state does not come up to those standards. As far as the
US military being exhausted... Nope! There are only a couple of hundred
thousand troops in the ME.. Wasting time waiting for all of you ME'ers
to become civilized and join the Human race. We have at our immediate
disposal approximately 3 million regular and reserve troops. Extended
disposal of approximately 46 million troops and the logistics to support
them. But we really don't need any troops to eliminate Israel! All we
have to do is stop its allowance and turn our backs. Are you really
so stupid and vain as to believe that The Arabs wouldn't have
overrun your shitty little state long ago, if not for the interventions
of Great Britain and America? I suggest strongly that you Jews and Arabs
and etc... Get your shit in a group and become good friendly nieghbors.
American citizens have tired of your fucking shills in our government
and the Jewish backlash is starting to show big time. Even most of the
Christian churchs in America that treated you as honored favorites
of your imaginary God, are now questioning the wisdom of having
their sons and Daughters bleed and die for a people that ..if it ever
had such favor has lost it centuries ago. The internet alone has
educated millions to the evil proclivities of the bloody Jews and the
murderous Islamics. America is being loaded with Islamics...Thanks to
Jewish legislators in America.. That alone tells us real Americans what
your goals are. Jews are like rats...When they get in the grainery..
They eat what they want and then shit on all the rest to spoil it for
others. 4000 years of Jewish attrocities and You assholes bleat about
a few years of Hitlers attrocities... Which by the way.. You people
invited. Many of our greatest Americans warned us about you/.. And we
chastised them for that.. We were fools. But we are learning.. And its
not too late to chastise the Jews with removal of our very generous
contributions of Money, Food, Arms and direct protection by military
and Diplomacy! The American people are starting to speak louder then the
corrupters of our politicians do. No More fucking Jews in American
elected or appointed offices.. And your false and phoney charges of
Bigotry and Antisemitism no longer hold water. Israel and its supporters
are nothing but murderous thugs! Even the fuckin ADL has been shown to
be an illegal and criminal activity of an unregistered foriegn State!
j***@netzero.com
2005-05-02 18:04:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
You're funny. The US military is almost exhausted in Iraq, and when it
withdraws, there will be no power that could stop ISraeli
occupation of
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
the oil fields if it came to that. Anyone who thinks that Israel gives
into threats has his ass where his brains should be. Israel is not a
banana republic.
Your right! Israel is not a banana republic. That shitty little
mercenary state does not come up to those standards. As far as the
US military being exhausted... Nope! There are only a couple of hundred
thousand troops in the ME.. Wasting time waiting for all of you ME'ers
to become civilized and join the Human race. We have at our immediate
disposal approximately 3 million regular and reserve troops. Extended
disposal of approximately 46 million troops<
The US has 46 million troops? Then why not send two soldiers for every
IRaqi and win the war?
Post by Don Ocean
and the logistics to support
them. But we really don't need any troops to eliminate Israel! All we
have to do is stop its allowance and turn our backs. Are you really
so stupid and vain as to believe that The Arabs wouldn't have
overrun your shitty little state long ago, if not for the
interventions
Post by Don Ocean
of Great Britain and America?<
Bullshit. Until 1967 Israel did just fine without US weapons or much
aid. The problems for Israel really started
when the US started selling arms to both ISrael AND the Arabs!
Post by Don Ocean
I suggest strongly that you Jews and Arabs<
Talk to the Arabs separately. I'm a Jew, not an Arab.
Post by Don Ocean
and etc... Get your shit in a group and become good friendly
nieghbors.<

Talk to the Mexicans. :)
Post by Don Ocean
American citizens have tired of your fucking shills in our government
and the Jewish backlash is starting to show big time. Even most of the
Christian churchs in America that treated you as honored favorites
of your imaginary God, are now questioning the wisdom of having
their sons and Daughters bleed and die for a people that ..if it ever
had such favor has lost it centuries ago. The internet alone has
educated millions to the evil proclivities of the bloody Jews and the
murderous Islamics.<
Israel could have nuked the Arabs out of existence decades ago, but the
US was worried about all of that
oil burning up. That's why it sent troops to Iraq, so that ISrael
wouldn't have to nuke Saddam out of existence
long ago.
Post by Don Ocean
America is being loaded with Islamics...Thanks to
Jewish legislators in America.. <
I agree that Liberals, many Jews, have done great damage.
Post by Don Ocean
That alone tells us real Americans what
your goals are. Jews are like rats...When they get in the grainery..
They eat what they want and then shit on all the rest to spoil it for
others.<
Nah, the Liberals just want to be nice, and thought that being nice to
Turd World people would make them
new friends. But as I could have told them long ago, darkies are just
as antisemitic as whiteys.
Post by Don Ocean
4000 years of Jewish attrocities and You assholes bleat about
a few years of Hitlers attrocities...<
Too bad your grandmother or children weren't gassed or shot in the
head. Maybe that would have given you
a different POV. Unfortunately, your grandmother or kids probably
weren't gassed or shot in the head, and
that is why you are the way you are.
Post by Don Ocean
Which by the way.. You people
invited. Many of our greatest Americans warned us about you/.. And we
chastised them for that.. We were fools. But we are learning.. And its
not too late to chastise the Jews with removal of our very generous
contributions of Money, Food, Arms and direct protection by military
and Diplomacy! The American people are starting to speak louder then the
corrupters of our politicians do. No More fucking Jews in American
elected or appointed offices.<
I agree, that Jews shouldn't hold high public office in any country
other than ISrael. That's about the only
thing I'll agree with you on.
Post by Don Ocean
And your false and phoney charges of
Bigotry and Antisemitism no longer hold water. Israel and its
supporters
Post by Don Ocean
are nothing but murderous thugs! Even the fuckin ADL has been shown to
be an illegal and criminal activity of an unregistered foriegn
State!<

You're the perfect case of a non-bigoted American who has "seen the
light" about us perfidious Jews.
Good for you. Keep ranting on.
Don Ocean
2005-05-02 22:24:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
You're funny. The US military is almost exhausted in Iraq, and when
it
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
withdraws, there will be no power that could stop ISraeli
occupation of
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
the oil fields if it came to that. Anyone who thinks that Israel
gives
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
into threats has his ass where his brains should be. Israel is not
a
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
banana republic.
Your right! Israel is not a banana republic. That shitty little
mercenary state does not come up to those standards. As far as the
US military being exhausted... Nope! There are only a couple of
hundred
Post by Don Ocean
thousand troops in the ME.. Wasting time waiting for all of you
ME'ers
Post by Don Ocean
to become civilized and join the Human race. We have at our immediate
disposal approximately 3 million regular and reserve troops. Extended
disposal of approximately 46 million troops<
The US has 46 million troops? Then why not send two soldiers for every
IRaqi and win the war?
The statement is that we can field 46 million troops just as we fielded
20 million troops in WWII. And we are not at war in Iraq. We are in a
terrorist insurgency and are now only backing up the Iraqi police
and military. You have noticed the sad losses of many Iraqi police
and military? And if we send more troops... How about we also
squash that shithole that started this stuff in the first
palce...Israel!!!
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
and the logistics to support
them. But we really don't need any troops to eliminate Israel! All we
have to do is stop its allowance and turn our backs. Are you really
so stupid and vain as to believe that The Arabs wouldn't have
overrun your shitty little state long ago, if not for the
interventions
Post by Don Ocean
of Great Britain and America?<
Bullshit. Until 1967 Israel did just fine without US weapons or much
aid. The problems for Israel really started
Really? And can you name the manufacturer of the weapons you used.
And you always had American dollars to spend.. Always!! What
American Jews didn't send Our OSS/CIA did. And looking at the
archives in the library of Congress... I see many spending bills
to support Israel! Even after you bastards bombed our medical personal
at the King David Hotel ..We still sent Medical ppersonal and supplies
to aid you!
Post by j***@netzero.com
when the US started selling arms to both ISrael AND the Arabs!
So what? You assholes sold weapons to the Arabs and stolen American
secrets to Russia. And you murdered American service men and innocent
civilians of all nations. What we caught you swine at was murdering
1200 Egyptian civilian and military prisoners in 1965. Turns out we were
wrong! Egypt found over 3,000 that had been executed by your IDF Gestapo
in 1967. You greedy SOB's made a grab for the Suez Canal and took the
Gaza, the west bank and the heights against countries that were not at
war with you... You siezed control of the fresh water sources. When our
President Eisenhower told you in 1957 to give back what you had
stolen... Your leaders basically told him to go fuck himself.. That is
when overt American aid was withdrawn. The Democrats gave it back to you
even though you were murdering Americans back then.(Fucking New York
Jewish Politicians). LBJ failed to run for office in 1968 due to his
fuckup in not bombing you bastards into dust for the attack on the US
ship(USS Liberty) in 1967. That bastard McNamara bailed out as Secretary
of Defense that had covered up the Jewish atrocity. His reward was a
fast promotion to head the world bank.. It is rumored that certain
American military intell services had put out a hit on him.. McNamara
never went anywhere to this day without heavy duty bodyguards. The
fucking Jews just love him...Just like they love Jonathon Pollard!
Many of the old boys in our military would revelle in seeing Israel
pay the price in blood for blood! That is your old testament law
of"an eye for an eye"!
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
I suggest strongly that you Jews and Arabs<
Talk to the Arabs separately. I'm a Jew, not an Arab.
Your half brothers and don't pull that arrogant shit of telling
me who I can address!! Damn punk Jew!
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
and etc... Get your shit in a group and become good friendly
nieghbors.<
Talk to the Mexicans. :)
Why are you still here if your paradise is Israel?
You and that bad smelling Ed should be making tracks for
your so-called homeland!
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
American citizens have tired of your fucking shills in our government
and the Jewish backlash is starting to show big time. Even most of
the
Post by Don Ocean
Christian churchs in America that treated you as honored favorites
of your imaginary God, are now questioning the wisdom of having
their sons and Daughters bleed and die for a people that ..if it ever
had such favor has lost it centuries ago. The internet alone has
educated millions to the evil proclivities of the bloody Jews and the
murderous Islamics.<
Israel could have nuked the Arabs out of existence decades ago, but the
US was worried about all of that
oil burning up. That's why it sent troops to Iraq, so that ISrael
wouldn't have to nuke Saddam out of existence
long ago.
If Israel had popped even a small nuke.. Russia would have made
Israel into a spitball and America would have looked the other
way and tried to figure out how to send the Zionists hiding here to
Russia! Sadam would have biologicaled Israel in a heartbeat. The
prevaling winds would have wiped Israel clean in 1.3 days. Look that
data up at the Brookings institute! Israel cannot survive against
the nations of Islam...So Idiot don't tempt them!
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
America is being loaded with Islamics...Thanks to
Jewish legislators in America.. <
I agree that Liberals, many Jews, have done great damage.
Hmmm? Well at least we agree on something.. Go to Grassfire and
sign the petition to secure America's borders against illegals
and to cut down the legals.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
That alone tells us real Americans what
your goals are. Jews are like rats...When they get in the grainery..
They eat what they want and then shit on all the rest to spoil it for
others.<
Nah, the Liberals just want to be nice, and thought that being nice to
Turd World people would make them
new friends. But as I could have told them long ago, darkies are just
as antisemitic as whiteys.
Huh? What the??????
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
4000 years of Jewish attrocities and You assholes bleat about
a few years of Hitlers attrocities...<
Too bad your grandmother or children weren't gassed or shot in the
head. Maybe that would have given you
a different POV. Unfortunately, your grandmother or kids probably
weren't gassed or shot in the head, and
that is why you are the way you are.
Everybody in my family serves.. Even some of the women..Grandma
was a WWI nurse!


And one of my Boys is with IBM.. Not too far from you. ExJarhead!
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
Which by the way.. You people
invited. Many of our greatest Americans warned us about you/.. And we
chastised them for that.. We were fools. But we are learning.. And
its
Post by Don Ocean
not too late to chastise the Jews with removal of our very generous
contributions of Money, Food, Arms and direct protection by military
and Diplomacy! The American people are starting to speak louder then
the
Post by Don Ocean
corrupters of our politicians do. No More fucking Jews in American
elected or appointed offices.<
I agree, that Jews shouldn't hold high public office in any country
other than ISrael. That's about the only
thing I'll agree with you on.
Actually that makes 2! ;-)
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
And your false and phoney charges of
Bigotry and Antisemitism no longer hold water. Israel and its
supporters
Post by Don Ocean
are nothing but murderous thugs! Even the fuckin ADL has been shown
to
Post by Don Ocean
be an illegal and criminal activity of an unregistered foriegn
State!<
You're the perfect case of a non-bigoted American who has "seen the
light" about us perfidious Jews.
Good for you. Keep ranting on.
I bet you talk that way down at the local redneck bar too! ;-p
j***@netzero.com
2005-05-03 16:13:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
You're funny. The US military is almost exhausted in Iraq, and when
it
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
withdraws, there will be no power that could stop ISraeli
occupation of
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
the oil fields if it came to that. Anyone who thinks that Israel
gives
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
into threats has his ass where his brains should be. Israel is not
a
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
banana republic.
Your right! Israel is not a banana republic. That shitty little
mercenary state does not come up to those standards. As far as the
US military being exhausted... Nope! There are only a couple of
hundred
Post by Don Ocean
thousand troops in the ME.. Wasting time waiting for all of you
ME'ers
Post by Don Ocean
to become civilized and join the Human race. We have at our
immediate
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
disposal approximately 3 million regular and reserve troops.
Extended
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
disposal of approximately 46 million troops<
The US has 46 million troops? Then why not send two soldiers for every
IRaqi and win the war?
The statement is that we can field 46 million troops just as we fielded
20 million troops in WWII.<
Actually, it was about 15 million in WWII, including half a million
Jews, but most of the really tough fighting was done by the Russians
and the Chinese, both of whom lost 20 million each. But the US forces
definitely did tip the balance against the Axis. THe role of the
Chinese in tying down 60% of the Jap army in Asia has never really told
much. But they did it with US help from Chennault and his "Flying
Tigers." Anyhow, if the JEws hadn't given the US the edge in getting
the atomic bomb first, probably another 100,000 or more American GIs
would be laying dead in the soil of Japan right now.
Post by Don Ocean
And we are not at war in Iraq. We are in a
terrorist insurgency and are now only backing up the Iraqi police
and military.<
Well, "we" were technically not at war in Korea or in Vietnam either.
The US refuses to lose any more wars, which is why it doesn't declare
war anymore :) If the US wants to win a war, it has to use atomic
bombs, unless you count little conflicts like the first Gulf War.
Post by Don Ocean
You have noticed the sad losses of many Iraqi police
and military? And if we send more troops... How about we also
squash that shithole that started this stuff in the first
palce...Israel!!!<
Yeah, go quit Iraq and take on ISrael.Sure, why not? How about
practicing on North Korea first? They only have six atomic bombs.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
and the logistics to support
them. But we really don't need any troops to eliminate Israel! All we
have to do is stop its allowance and turn our backs. Are you really
so stupid and vain as to believe that The Arabs wouldn't have
overrun your shitty little state long ago, if not for the
interventions
Post by Don Ocean
of Great Britain and America?<
Bullshit. Until 1967 Israel did just fine without US weapons or
much aid. The problems for Israel really started
Post by Don Ocean
Really? And can you name the manufacturer of the weapons you used.<
Not "me" but Israel. But sure, in the 1948 war most arms came from
Russia, mainly via Czechoslovakia, and the Israelis also managed to get
some WWII leftover junk. STalin was pissed at the Jews after 1948 when
despite giving the ISraelis arms, the ISraelis didn't make a flat out
pro-Stalinist communist state, and turned mainly towards the West.
As for the 1956 and 1967 wars, most of its first line fighters were
made by Dassault (a French Jew btw), such as the Mystere in 1956 and
the Mirage in 1967. While the ISraelis did use some modified WWII
vintagee Sherman tanks and half-tracks, most of its first line battle
tanks in 1967 were British Centurions.
Post by Don Ocean
And you always had American dollars to spend.. Always!! What
American Jews didn't send Our OSS/CIA did.<
While it is true that US economic aid was vital in the first years of
the state to feed the many new penniless immigrants flooding in from
Europe and the Arab countries, there was almost no US arms until
Kennedy sold the sophisticated Hawk AA missiles in 1962, mainly out of
fear that Egypt'S Russian bombers might be used to bomb ISrael's
nuclear reactor in Dimona, and that Israel might use nuclear materials
to attack Egypt first, perhaps with radiological bombs if not atomic
bombs, to take out Egypt's Russian bombers that were seen as a threat
to Dimona and to Israel's cities. But before 1962 there was a pretty
strict embargo on US arms sales to both Israel and the Arabs. Even
after 1962 there were few US arms sales, mostly ammunition, despite
ISraeli pleas to purchase US F-4 Phantom fighters. Those were finally
sold AFTER Israel already defeated the Arabs in 1967, but came in
useful in the air war over the Suez Canal in the early '70s. But the
main point is, that Israel roundly defeated the ARabs, and gained all
of the so-called "occupied territories" using French planes and British
tanks.
Post by Don Ocean
And looking at the
archives in the library of Congress... I see many spending bills
to support Israel! Even after you bastards bombed our medical
personal at the King David Hotel ..We still sent Medical ppersonal and
supplies to aid you!
Don't know what you're talking about. Please provide references. Maybe
there were some US personnel in the King David bombing, but I've never
heard of it. I'd like to see some references. There were Jews killed
working in that building as well.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
when the US started selling arms to both ISrael AND the Arabs!
So what? You assholes sold weapons to the Arabs and stolen American
secrets to Russia. And you murdered American service men and innocent
civilians of all nations. What we caught you swine at was murdering
1200 Egyptian civilian and military prisoners in 1965.<

It certainly wasn't in 1965, because in that year Egypt was busy
bombing Yemen with poison gas. I think the incident you are referring
to happened in the 1967 Six Day war, and I've heard numbers from 800 to
1200 as you state. No excuses for that; if true it was a war crime. But
I wonder how many innocent Vietnamese were killed in "free fire" zones
in Vietnam? I bet more than 1,000.
Post by Don Ocean
Turns out we were
wrong! Egypt found over 3,000 that had been executed by your IDF
Gestapo in 1967.<

At least you finally got the year right. But lots of people die in the
desert for lack of water in war. What evidence is there of those 3,000
being executed? Maybe they were just killed in battle? If there is
evidence, I'd like to see it.
Post by Don Ocean
You greedy SOB's made a grab for the Suez Canal<
Sure because in contradiction to the 1949 Armistice agreement, Egypt
was not permitting any shipping to Israel to go through, even on
non-Israeli ships. So finally, when the Six Day War was started by the
Egyptians in blockading the Straits of Tiran (the port of Eilat),
the ISraelis captured the Suez Canal which was then closed to all
shipping. Hey, if ISrael can't get shipping through the Canal, why
should anybody else ? :) Actually, in a way it was boon to the US
military, because it also kept Russian ships from going from the
Mediterranean over to Vietnam. And big supertankers soon brought down
the cost of oil shipments even using the long route, as they couldn't
use the Suez Canal anyway.
Post by Don Ocean
and took the
Gaza, the west bank and the heights<
Say what? Gaza was controlled by Egypt since 1948, and was used by
them to send Palestinian terrorists (fedayeen) to kill Israelis all
along. Jordan fired 6,000 artillery shells into Israel despite Israeli
pleas not to enter the war. Syria instigated the war in part by trying
to close off water supplies to ISrael, and shelling Israeli kibbutzim
down below all along. Actually, it was the Soviets who really fed false
information to the Arabs wanting to stir up trouble to divert the US
tied down in Vietnam, but didn't realize that it would all get so
out-of-hand.
against countries that were not at> war with you... You siezed control
of the fresh water sources.<

Syria was trying to divert water all along to try to cut Israel off.
Anyhow, the Golan was first mentioned in the Bible, was originally
supposed to be in the British Mandate, but they gave it to France, and
so Syria shouldn't have had it in the first place. All they made out of
the Golan was a fortified hell. The Israelis turned it into another
garden spot.
Post by Don Ocean
When our
President Eisenhower told you in 1957 to give back what you had
stolen... Your leaders basically told him to go fuck himself..<
Hey, Kruschev was threatening to nuke Israel with rockets too! So what?
That's why Israel (with French help) developed its own nukes and IRBM
missiles capable of hitting the southern part of the Soviet Union too.
Post by Don Ocean
That is when overt American aid was withdrawn. The Democrats gave it
back to you even though you were murdering Americans back then.(Fucking
New York Jewish Politicians).<

That isn't true. There was no military aid to speak of, and only a bit
of economic aid before 1967. If anything, it was Russia in 1948, and
France after 1954 and before 1967 that helped Israel get by more than
the US at that time.
Post by Don Ocean
LBJ failed to run for office in 1968 due to his
fuckup in not bombing you bastards into dust for the attack on the US
ship(USS Liberty) in 1967. That bastard McNamara bailed out as
Secretary of Defense that had covered up the Jewish atrocity. His
reward was a fast promotion to head the world bank.. It is rumored that
certain American military intell services had put out a hit on him..<

Do you work for Al-Jazeera? You should because your take on history
is, well, so Arab :)
Post by Don Ocean
McNamara
never went anywhere to this day without heavy duty bodyguards. The
fucking Jews just love him...Just like they love Jonathon Pollard!
Many of the old boys in our military would revelle in seeing Israel
pay the price in blood for blood! That is your old testament law
of"an eye for an eye"!<
Antisemitism in the US state department and DoD was hardly news to most
Jews and Israelis. Despite it all, Israel prevailed. Anyway, the
Talmud says that "eye for an eye" should be interpreted as monetary
compensation for accidentally taking out an eye, or else nearly
everyone would be half-blind. Jewish law did not remain stuck in desert
tribal law.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
I suggest strongly that you Jews and Arabs<
Talk to the Arabs separately. I'm a Jew, not an Arab.
Your half brothers and don't pull that arrogant shit of telling
me who I can address!! Damn punk Jew!<
You can talk disrespectfully to the offspring of Hagar if you wish, but
we're the "Chosen People" and don't you forget it :)
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
and etc... Get your shit in a group and become good friendly
nieghbors.<
Talk to the Mexicans. :)
Why are you still here if your paradise is Israel?<
Israel is no paradise. Paradise is in heaven, wherever that is.
Post by Don Ocean
You and that bad smelling Ed should be making tracks for
your so-called homeland!<
Thanks for the advice.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
American citizens have tired of your fucking shills in our
governmentand the Jewish backlash is starting to show big time. Even
most of
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
the
Post by Don Ocean
Christian churchs in America that treated you as honored favorites
of your imaginary God, are now questioning the wisdom of having
their sons and Daughters bleed and die for a people that ..if it ever
had such favor has lost it centuries ago. The internet alone has
educated millions to the evil proclivities of the bloody Jews and the
murderous Islamics.<
Israel could have nuked the Arabs out of existence decades ago, but
the US was worried about all of that
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
oil burning up. That's why it sent troops to Iraq, so that ISrael
wouldn't have to nuke Saddam out of existence
long ago.<
If Israel had popped even a small nuke.. Russia would have made
Israel into a spitball and America would have looked the other
way and tried to figure out how to send the Zionists hiding here to
Russia!<
Oh, and you think Russia is out of range of ISraeli nukes? Anyhow, why
should Russia intervene in behalf of the Arabs? Russia also sells oil,
and its oil would become even more valuable if the Persian Gulf
oilfields were put out of commission for a while.
Post by Don Ocean
Sadam would have biologicaled Israel in a heartbeat.<
He'd never would have had the chance.
Post by Don Ocean
The
prevaling winds would have wiped Israel clean in 1.3 days. Look that
data up at the Brookings institute! Israel cannot survive against
the nations of Islam...So Idiot don't tempt them!<
EVery Israeli house and building has a fallout shelter. In Israel, it's
the law. I bet more Israelis would survive than Arabs. Certainly the
Arabs in Judah and Samaria wouldn't.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
America is being loaded with Islamics...Thanks to
Jewish legislators in America.. <
I agree that Liberals, many Jews, have done great damage.
Hmmm? Well at least we agree on something.. Go to Grassfire and
sign the petition to secure America's borders against illegals
and to cut down the legals.<
I'm a legal immigrant, but I am very much against ILLEGALS. At least
the JEwish immigrants in the 1930s and after WWII were literate and
didn't require much educating. IN fact, many were highly educated and
were able to immediately contribute to the scientific, business and
artistic life of the country. Same with the Hindus and the Chinese in
more recent years. But why we're allowing illiterate peons to overrun
the country is not only the fault of Jewish liberals, but I'm certain
is equally if not more so the fault of top-WASP management and business
interests who only know how to make money with slavery or with slave
wages. Without a cheap, slave-wage workforce, they have no clue as to
how to make a profit. They don't have Jewish brains. That's why when
their backs are againt the wall, they often hire a Jewish CEO, like
Michael Eisner, to pull them into the black. But, in recent years this
too has been changing because American Jews are getting dumber and
spoiled like WASPs.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
That alone tells us real Americans what
your goals are. Jews are like rats...When they get in the
grainery..
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
They eat what they want and then shit on all the rest to spoil it for
others.<
Nah, the Liberals just want to be nice, and thought that being nice
to Turd World people would make them
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
new friends. But as I could have told them long ago, darkies are just
as antisemitic as whiteys.
Huh? What the??????<
Oh, yeah, I grew up in the Projects of Brooklyn in the 1950s, and I
learned black antisemitism first hand. Like, "Hey Jewboy, let's see
what yo got in yo' pockets. What I fine (sic) is mine." I never really
got to suburbia either.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
4000 years of Jewish attrocities and You assholes bleat about
a few years of Hitlers attrocities...<
Too bad your grandmother or children weren't gassed or shot in the
head. Maybe that would have given you
a different POV. Unfortunately, your grandmother or kids probably
weren't gassed or shot in the head, and
that is why you are the way you are.
Everybody in my family serves.. Even some of the women..Grandma
was a WWI nurse!
And one of my Boys is with IBM.. Not too far from you. ExJarhead!
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
Which by the way.. You people
invited. Many of our greatest Americans warned us about you/.. And we
chastised them for that.. We were fools. But we are learning.. And
its
Post by Don Ocean
not too late to chastise the Jews with removal of our very generous
contributions of Money, Food, Arms and direct protection by
military
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
and Diplomacy! The American people are starting to speak louder then
the
Post by Don Ocean
corrupters of our politicians do. No More fucking Jews in American
elected or appointed offices.<
I agree, that Jews shouldn't hold high public office in any country
other than ISrael. That's about the only
thing I'll agree with you on.
Actually that makes 2! ;-)
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
And your false and phoney charges of
Bigotry and Antisemitism no longer hold water. Israel and its
supporters
Post by Don Ocean
are nothing but murderous thugs! Even the fuckin ADL has been shown
to
Post by Don Ocean
be an illegal and criminal activity of an unregistered foriegn
State!<
You're the perfect case of a non-bigoted American who has "seen the
light" about us perfidious Jews.
Good for you. Keep ranting on.
I bet you talk that way down at the local redneck bar too! ;-p
Don Ocean
2005-05-03 19:47:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
You're funny. The US military is almost exhausted in Iraq, and
when
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
it
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
withdraws, there will be no power that could stop ISraeli
occupation of
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
the oil fields if it came to that. Anyone who thinks that Israel
gives
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
into threats has his ass where his brains should be. Israel is not
a
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
banana republic.
Your right! Israel is not a banana republic. That shitty little
mercenary state does not come up to those standards. As far as the
US military being exhausted... Nope! There are only a couple of
hundred
Post by Don Ocean
thousand troops in the ME.. Wasting time waiting for all of you
ME'ers
Post by Don Ocean
to become civilized and join the Human race. We have at our
immediate
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
disposal approximately 3 million regular and reserve troops.
Extended
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
disposal of approximately 46 million troops<
The US has 46 million troops? Then why not send two soldiers for
every
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
IRaqi and win the war?
The statement is that we can field 46 million troops just as we
fielded
Post by Don Ocean
20 million troops in WWII.<
Actually, it was about 15 million in WWII,
Nope.... 20 million..check the records at the library of congress and
the archives pf the Veterans adminstration.

including half a million
Post by Don Ocean
Jews,
Actually 152,000 and most had to be drafted.. The Jews were pretty
chintzy about helping fund the underground railway in Europe also!

but most of the really tough fighting was done by the Russians
Post by Don Ocean
and the Chinese,
Yep! no argument there.. And done with American logistics and lendlease.

both of whom lost 20 million each. But the US forces
Post by Don Ocean
definitely did tip the balance against the Axis. THe role of the
Chinese in tying down 60%
I am afraid you skewed those figures a bit! ;-(

of the Jap army in Asia has never really told
Post by Don Ocean
much. But they did it with US help from Chennault and his "Flying
Tigers."
Please don't forget the Aussies and the Brits and some American
volunteers that were not under Chenault... mostly Changs old lady was
under Chenault! ;-p

Anyhow, if the JEws hadn't given the US the edge in getting
Post by Don Ocean
the atomic bomb first,
The Jews were paid hired hands and not one fucking Jew invented
cutting edge technology.. We were well aware of Atomic reactions
since the 1800's. Germanys heavy water research and race to develope a
bomb is what motivated America to invest heavily and steal the fire
from Germany. The only real information furnished by Jews was by
EnricoFermi(Italian Jew) He came up with the detonating devices after
heavy reading of German technical papers stolen by our friends the
Brits. At Columbia university there were thousands of Scientist and
Mathematicians...and a few Jews.. Now typical of all Jews...They now
claim to have invented even oxygen.. Well Asshole America spent Billions
and used thousands of the finest brains in the world to develope that.
The real contribution to world nuclear devices was the Rosenburgs.
Typical of Jews ..They promptly sold us out to the Russians. You just
gotta love those jew spys...they are all over America stealing anything
they can get there hands on..

probably another 100,000 or more American GIs
Post by Don Ocean
would be laying dead in the soil of Japan right now.
Actaully that is possible...But there was also a plan to starve them out
of Japan.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
And we are not at war in Iraq. We are in a
terrorist insurgency and are now only backing up the Iraqi police
and military.<
Well, "we" were technically not at war in Korea or in Vietnam either.
The US refuses to lose any more wars, which is why it doesn't declare
war anymore :) If the US wants to win a war, it has to use atomic
bombs, unless you count little conflicts like the first Gulf War.
Not really...We do have things more horrific then nuclear!
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
You have noticed the sad losses of many Iraqi police
and military? And if we send more troops... How about we also
squash that shithole that started this stuff in the first
palce...Israel!!!<
Yeah, go quit Iraq and take on ISrael.Sure, why not? How about
practicing on North Korea first? They only have six atomic bombs.
Actually none of the above is scary... A walk in the park if the
word is given for a real war with no limits on us. We could have smoked
both Korea and VietNam if the Rules of engagement were not skewed by
idiots. Most of those idiot by the way were Jews. Kissinger and
McNamara were directly responsible for many many of our losses.
If it had not been for them ...Israel would already be a smoking hole in
the ground for its atrocities in 1967 against American servicemen,
executed Egyptians .. Lebanese, Syrians...Where should I stop?
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
and the logistics to support
them. But we really don't need any troops to eliminate Israel! All
we
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
have to do is stop its allowance and turn our backs. Are you really
so stupid and vain as to believe that The Arabs wouldn't have
overrun your shitty little state long ago, if not for the
interventions
Post by Don Ocean
of Great Britain and America?<
Bullshit. Until 1967 Israel did just fine without US weapons or
much aid. The problems for Israel really started
Post by Don Ocean
Really? And can you name the manufacturer of the weapons you used.<
Not "me" but Israel. But sure, in the 1948 war most arms came from
Russia, mainly via Czechoslovakia, and the Israelis also managed to get
some WWII leftover junk. STalin was pissed at the Jews after 1948 when
despite giving the ISraelis arms, the ISraelis didn't make a flat out
pro-Stalinist communist state, and turned mainly towards the West.
As for the 1956 and 1967 wars, most of its first line fighters were
made by Dassault (a French Jew btw), such as the Mystere in 1956 and
the Mirage in 1967. While the ISraelis did use some modified WWII
vintagee Sherman tanks and half-tracks, most of its first line battle
tanks in 1967 were British Centurions.
I guess you forgot about the Bradleys.. Israel favorite armorat that time!
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
And you always had American dollars to spend.. Always!! What
American Jews didn't send Our OSS/CIA did.<
While it is true that US economic aid was vital in the first years of
the state to feed the many new penniless immigrants flooding in from
Europe and the Arab countries, there was almost no US arms until
Kennedy sold the sophisticated Hawk AA missiles in 1962,
We picked up lots of M3's from the prisoners we took in 1957..
A few Thompsons and some M1 carbines.. Mortar tubes...Grenades..
some 500 lb bombs... Enough American arms to piss Eisenhower off!
So don't tell me what I saw and didn't see!

mainly out of
Post by Don Ocean
fear that Egypt'S Russian bombers might be used to bomb ISrael's
nuclear reactor in Dimona, and that Israel might use nuclear materials
to attack Egypt first,
You did attack Egypt first.. That try at the Suez canal...All the time
we had made a friend of Nasser and you SOB's sneak attacked and even
murdered Americans.. Isrtael no longer deserves to exist. the world
really should Stick all you assholes on a deserted Island with a
permanent blockade. Just to insure the security of the rest of Mankind..
Maybe send you the Islamic to paly with you. ;-( After all..you people
stirred them up to grab more of their land!

perhaps with radiological bombs if not atomic
Post by Don Ocean
bombs, to take out Egypt's Russian bombers that were seen as a threat
to Dimona and to Israel's cities. But before 1962 there was a pretty
strict embargo on US arms sales to both Israel and the Arabs. Even
after 1962 there were few US arms sales, mostly ammunition, despite
ISraeli pleas to purchase US F-4 Phantom fighters. Those were finally
sold AFTER Israel already defeated the Arabs in 1967,
You bastards did not defeat the Arabs ... You murdered them in a sneak
attack to steal land and water. You murdered an American ship and 2
observer teams to cover your bloody asses! And your still doing the same
damned thing today. No non-Jew is safe from you scum. And you would
murder even your own people to gain a dime!

but came in
Post by Don Ocean
useful in the air war over the Suez Canal in the early '70s. But the
main point is, that Israel roundly defeated the ARabs, and gained all
of the so-called "occupied territories" using French planes and British
tanks.
Note...The Term "Occupied Territories" ! GET THEE THE HELL OUT!
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
And looking at the
archives in the library of Congress... I see many spending bills
to support Israel! Even after you bastards bombed our medical
personal at the King David Hotel ..We still sent Medical ppersonal and
supplies to aid you!
Don't know what you're talking about. Please provide references. Maybe
there were some US personnel in the King David bombing, but I've never
heard of it. I'd like to see some references. There were Jews killed
working in that building as well.
Thats what I mean... You bastards would even murder your own for gain! ;-(
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
when the US started selling arms to both ISrael AND the Arabs!
So what? You assholes sold weapons to the Arabs and stolen American
secrets to Russia. And you murdered American service men and innocent
civilians of all nations. What we caught you swine at was murdering
1200 Egyptian civilian and military prisoners in 1965.<
That was a mistype...1967...
Post by Don Ocean
It certainly wasn't in 1965, because in that year Egypt was busy
bombing Yemen with poison gas. I think the incident you are referring
to happened in the 1967 Six Day war, and I've heard numbers from 800 to
1200 as you state. No excuses for that; if true it was a war crime. But
I wonder how many innocent Vietnamese were killed in "free fire" zones
in Vietnam? I bet more than 1,000.
And I also condemn that and we did prosecute those that came to light!
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
Turns out we were
wrong! Egypt found over 3,000 that had been executed by your IDF
Gestapo in 1967.<
At least you finally got the year right. But lots of people die in the
desert for lack of water in war. What evidence is there of those 3,000
being executed? Maybe they were just killed in battle? If there is
evidence, I'd like to see it.
I guess those killed in battle are always shot in the back of the head
etc. You should be able to see the evidence from the Egyptians.. They
are suing Israel for those horrendous crimes.. The Jews that whine
about the Holocaust should be mortified and deeply ashamed that Jews
would and could do such terrible deeds.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
You greedy SOB's made a grab for the Suez Canal<
Sure because in contradiction to the 1949 Armistice agreement, Egypt
was not permitting any shipping to Israel to go through, even on
non-Israeli ships. So finally, when the Six Day War was started by the
Egyptians in blockading the Straits of Tiran (the port of Eilat),
the ISraelis captured the Suez Canal which was then closed to all
shipping.
Actually not! American war ships patrolled that and no Jews were
allowed! The Jews had no treaty to use that canal.. and they paid
for that privilege until the Egyptians got tired of Israels constant
sniping and border incursions.. They had an absolute right to cut you
off...And you stayed cutoff for years afterwards.

Hey, if ISrael can't get shipping through the Canal, why
Post by Don Ocean
should anybody else ? :)
Everybody else did with American guarantees.. Eisenhower would
have kissed you asshole off in a heartbeat.. But America wasn't quite
ready for that after Korea.. You Jews shit on us everytime we were
involved elsewhere and you can bet that many of us old Vets will
keep the pressure on plolitically to insure Israel gets little
or no money from our hard working Gentile taxpayers.. Like Rachel Cories
folks! ;-(

Actually, in a way it was boon to the US
Post by Don Ocean
military, because it also kept Russian ships from going from the
Mediterranean over to Vietnam. And big supertankers soon brought down
the cost of oil shipments even using the long route, as they couldn't
use the Suez Canal anyway.
Post by Don Ocean
and took the
Gaza, the west bank and the heights<
Say what? Gaza was controlled by Egypt since 1948, and was used by
them to send Palestinian terrorists (fedayeen) to kill Israelis all
along. Jordan fired 6,000 artillery shells into Israel despite Israeli
pleas not to enter the war. Syria instigated the war in part by trying
to close off water supplies to ISrael,
Nope...that was Israels exscuse to grab control of all the water.

and shelling Israeli kibbutzim

I saw those Kibbutzim.. They were the ones that started the firing!
It was in Moshe Dayans book! Read it you idiot!
Post by Don Ocean
down below all along. Actually, it was the Soviets who really fed false
information to the Arabs wanting to stir up trouble to divert the US
tied down in Vietnam, but didn't realize that it would all get so
out-of-hand.
Nope! You bastards murdered American Sailors and there is no way that
you can blame that on the Russians.
Post by Don Ocean
against countries that were not at> war with you... You siezed control
of the fresh water sources.<
Syria was trying to divert water all along to try to cut Israel off.
Anyhow, the Golan was first mentioned in the Bible, was originally
supposed to be in the British Mandate, but they gave it to France, and
so Syria shouldn't have had it in the first place. All they made out of
the Golan was a fortified hell. The Israelis turned it into another
garden spot.
Ya right...The Jews are Gods people Bullshit again!
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
When our
President Eisenhower told you in 1957 to give back what you had
stolen... Your leaders basically told him to go fuck himself..<
Hey, Kruschev was threatening to nuke Israel with rockets too!
Israel wasn't worth rocketing and we really should have paid the
Russians to remove Israel the pimple on our ass!

So what?
Post by Don Ocean
That's why Israel (with French help) developed its own nukes and IRBM
missiles capable of hitting the southern part of the Soviet Union too.
Actually they stole and bribed for American technology.. If you were
so fucking smart.. You would have made cars and not tanks.
Made peace and not war...The entire history of the Jews is war
and strife.. Now Why is that? And you wonder why we would like
to eliminate you and have peace on earth!
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
That is when overt American aid was withdrawn. The Democrats gave it
back to you even though you were murdering Americans back then.(Fucking
New York Jewish Politicians).<
That isn't true. There was no military aid to speak of, and only a bit
of economic aid before 1967. If anything, it was Russia in 1948, and
France after 1954 and before 1967 that helped Israel get by more than
the US at that time.
Yes! It is well known that you bastards were so damned greedy that you
were playing everybody!
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
LBJ failed to run for office in 1968 due to his
fuckup in not bombing you bastards into dust for the attack on the US
ship(USS Liberty) in 1967. That bastard McNamara bailed out as
Secretary of Defense that had covered up the Jewish atrocity. His
reward was a fast promotion to head the world bank.. It is rumored that
certain American military intell services had put out a hit on him..<
Do you work for Al-Jazeera? You should because your take on history
is, well, so Arab :)
No...so Gentile... The Selfsame Gentiles you bastards have been
murdering and stealing from!
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
McNamara
never went anywhere to this day without heavy duty bodyguards. The
fucking Jews just love him...Just like they love Jonathon Pollard!
Many of the old boys in our military would revelle in seeing Israel
pay the price in blood for blood! That is your old testament law
of"an eye for an eye"!<
Antisemitism in the US state department and DoD was hardly news to most
Jews and Israelis.
There it comes...the rancid charge of antisemitism! Every time
a Jew commits crimes against humanity and gets chastised or
even chided for it...*ITS ANTISEMITISM!*.. Hey Sport...Its not
us murdering Semite Arabs... Its *YOU*! And America must take all
steps to protect itself from the JEWS. They have proven opver
and over that they are America's worst enemy!

Despite it all, Israel prevailed. Anyway, the
Post by Don Ocean
Talmud says that "eye for an eye" should be interpreted as monetary
compensation for accidentally taking out an eye, or else nearly
everyone would be half-blind. Jewish law did not remain stuck in desert
tribal law.
Actually that is not what your military staff of the 1950's said..so
what Talmud were they reading! Again Read Moshe Dayans book!
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
I suggest strongly that you Jews and Arabs<
Talk to the Arabs separately. I'm a Jew, not an Arab.
Your half brothers and don't pull that arrogant shit of telling
me who I can address!! Damn punk Jew!<
You can talk disrespectfully to the offspring of Hagar if you wish, but
we're the "Chosen People" and don't you forget it :)
Should the necessity of choosing you people as targets... I agree
you will be the chosen people. As for that religious crap... I can
agree that the 10 commandments make sense for s civilized world.
But the crutch of religious insanity can bear no weight of proof!
It was used to control people... And to bilk them of their hard
earned goods! How very Jewish! ;-p
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
and etc... Get your shit in a group and become good friendly
nieghbors.<
Talk to the Mexicans. :)
Why are you still here if your paradise is Israel?<
Israel is no paradise. Paradise is in heaven, wherever that is.
Post by Don Ocean
You and that bad smelling Ed should be making tracks for
your so-called homeland!<
Thanks for the advice.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
American citizens have tired of your fucking shills in our
governmentand the Jewish backlash is starting to show big time. Even
most of
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
the
Post by Don Ocean
Christian churchs in America that treated you as honored favorites
of your imaginary God, are now questioning the wisdom of having
their sons and Daughters bleed and die for a people that ..if it
ever
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
had such favor has lost it centuries ago. The internet alone has
educated millions to the evil proclivities of the bloody Jews and
the
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
murderous Islamics.<
Israel could have nuked the Arabs out of existence decades ago, but
the US was worried about all of that
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
oil burning up. That's why it sent troops to Iraq, so that ISrael
wouldn't have to nuke Saddam out of existence
long ago.<
If Israel had popped even a small nuke.. Russia would have made
Israel into a spitball and America would have looked the other
way and tried to figure out how to send the Zionists hiding here to
Russia!<
Oh, and you think Russia is out of range of ISraeli nukes? Anyhow, why
should Russia intervene in behalf of the Arabs? Russia also sells oil,
and its oil would become even more valuable if the Persian Gulf
oilfields were put out of commission for a while.
Post by Don Ocean
Sadam would have biologicaled Israel in a heartbeat.<
He'd never would have had the chance.
Post by Don Ocean
The
prevaling winds would have wiped Israel clean in 1.3 days. Look that
data up at the Brookings institute! Israel cannot survive against
the nations of Islam...So Idiot don't tempt them!<
EVery Israeli house and building has a fallout shelter. In Israel, it's
the law. I bet more Israelis would survive than Arabs. Certainly the
Arabs in Judah and Samaria wouldn't
lets say that 10 million Arabs die and 5.2 million Jews Die...
The Arabs have won and you have lost! The Arabs number in the several
hundred million.. Total Known count of Jews is 15 million.. 5.2
million in Israel, 5 million in America and roughly another 5 million
skulking in the alleyways of the rest of the world.

.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
America is being loaded with Islamics...Thanks to
Jewish legislators in America.. <
I agree that Liberals, many Jews, have done great damage.
Hmmm? Well at least we agree on something.. Go to Grassfire and
sign the petition to secure America's borders against illegals
and to cut down the legals.<
I'm a legal immigrant, but I am very much against ILLEGALS. At least
the JEwish immigrants in the 1930s and after WWII were literate and
didn't require much educating. IN fact, many were highly educated and
were able to immediately contribute to the scientific, business and
artistic life of the country. Same with the Hindus and the Chinese in
more recent years. But why we're allowing illiterate peons to overrun
the country is not only the fault of Jewish liberals, but I'm certain
is equally if not more so the fault of top-WASP management and business
interests who only know how to make money with slavery or with slave
wages. Without a cheap, slave-wage workforce, they have no clue as to
how to make a profit. They don't have Jewish brains. That's why when
their backs are againt the wall, they often hire a Jewish CEO, like
Michael Eisner, to pull them into the black. But, in recent years this
too has been changing because American Jews are getting dumber and
spoiled like WASPs.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
That alone tells us real Americans what
your goals are. Jews are like rats...When they get in the
grainery..
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
They eat what they want and then shit on all the rest to spoil it
for
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
others.<
Nah, the Liberals just want to be nice, and thought that being nice
to Turd World people would make them
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
new friends. But as I could have told them long ago, darkies are
just
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
as antisemitic as whiteys.
Huh? What the??????<
Oh, yeah, I grew up in the Projects of Brooklyn in the 1950s, and I
learned black antisemitism first hand. Like, "Hey Jewboy, let's see
what yo got in yo' pockets. What I fine (sic) is mine." I never really
got to suburbia either.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
4000 years of Jewish attrocities and You assholes bleat about
a few years of Hitlers attrocities...<
Too bad your grandmother or children weren't gassed or shot in the
head. Maybe that would have given you
a different POV. Unfortunately, your grandmother or kids probably
weren't gassed or shot in the head, and
that is why you are the way you are.
Everybody in my family serves.. Even some of the women..Grandma
was a WWI nurse!
And one of my Boys is with IBM.. Not too far from you. ExJarhead!
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
Which by the way.. You people
invited. Many of our greatest Americans warned us about you/.. And
we
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
chastised them for that.. We were fools. But we are learning.. And
its
Post by Don Ocean
not too late to chastise the Jews with removal of our very generous
contributions of Money, Food, Arms and direct protection by
military
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
and Diplomacy! The American people are starting to speak louder
then
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
the
Post by Don Ocean
corrupters of our politicians do. No More fucking Jews in American
elected or appointed offices.<
I agree, that Jews shouldn't hold high public office in any country
other than ISrael. That's about the only
thing I'll agree with you on.
Actually that makes 2! ;-)
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
And your false and phoney charges of
Bigotry and Antisemitism no longer hold water. Israel and its
supporters
Post by Don Ocean
are nothing but murderous thugs! Even the fuckin ADL has been shown
to
Post by Don Ocean
be an illegal and criminal activity of an unregistered foriegn
State!<
You're the perfect case of a non-bigoted American who has "seen the
light" about us perfidious Jews.
Good for you. Keep ranting on.
I bet you talk that way down at the local redneck bar too! ;-p
j***@netzero.com
2005-05-05 16:08:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by j***@netzero.com
Don Ocean wrote:...
Actually, it was about 15 million in WWII,
Nope.... 20 million..check the records at the library of congress and
the archives pf the Veterans adminstration.<
Never heard that figure, 12-15 milliion being the figures I've read.
You're the first I've ever heard claiming
20 milllion.
Post by j***@netzero.com
including half a million Jews,<
Actually 152,000 and most had to be drafted.. The Jews were pretty
chintzy about helping fund the underground railway in Europe also!<
The figure I've always heard was half a million. Fifteen million
non-JEws, which then was ten percent of the
population, and half million Jews or 10% of the American Jewish
population. Which book is the source of your figures again?
As for most Jews having to be drafted, that may be so.
I don't know. Most GEntile Americans had to be drafted too. In all the
wars up to and including WWII, American Jews generally went to war in
the same proportion as the rest of the population. This changed when
college students were exempted from the draft, as in Vietnam.
Post by j***@netzero.com
but most of the really tough fighting was done by the Russians
and the Chinese,<
Yep! no argument there.. And done with American logistics and
lendlease.<

I know. My father was fought from Leninigrad to Berlin and killed a few
Nazis on the way.
Post by j***@netzero.com
both of whom lost 20 million each. But the US forces
definitely did tip the balance against the Axis. THe role of the
Chinese in tying down 60%
...> Anyhow, if the JEws hadn't given the US the edge in getting
Post by j***@netzero.com
the atomic bomb first,
The Jews were paid hired hands and not one fucking Jew invented
cutting edge technology..<
Bullshit. Jews practically invented nuclear physics.
Post by j***@netzero.com
We were well aware of Atomic reactions since the 1800's.<
The theory of the atomic nature of matter hardly existed until well
late in the 1880s. And Einstein's famous 1905 equation equating mass
and energy (E=mc^2) was the first insight into the amount and
possibiity of changing mass directly into energy since the time of
medieval alchemists, and Leo Szilard was the first to imagine (and
patent in England) how a nuclear chain reaction could be made possible,
and how to control it. It is true that the Germans first actually split
the atom in 1939, but that is exactly the event that made Szilard round
up Einstein in Princeton, and got Edward Teller to chauffeur the both
of them to see FDR, to persuade him to start a nuclear program. With
the generous $6,000 that Roosevelt gave Szilard, he called in his
Italian mechanic, Enrico Fermi, from Italy to join him in Columbia
university (in Manhattan, hence "Manhattan Project," and they went on
from there to the University of Chicao to build the first little
functioning graphite-based nuclear reactor - the very first nuclear
reactor in history. Hence the theory
was confirmed. From there to a bomb I admit required a helluva lot of
good engineering.The Germans gave up on graphite, but Szilard insisted,
and Szilard proved right, which is why the US got a quantum leap over
Germany towards an atomic bomb. As for practical bomb technology
itself, that was a different matter and
I agree that Jews were less involved in the engineering, except for
maybe Oppenheimer the director of the
entire bomb project. I don't know much about the nuts and bolts part.
I leave that to the nuts and the dolts :)
Post by j***@netzero.com
Germanys heavy water research and race to develope a
bomb is what motivated America to invest heavily and steal the fire
from Germany. <
You are so ass-backwards you've GOT to be an Arab! The Germans turned
to heavy water because they
gave up on graphite. But when graphite did not work well in the US,
Szilard insisted that it wasn't pure enough.
The Germans believe deeply in their own test instruments; Szilard
believed deeply in his own brain. He won.
Post by j***@netzero.com
The only real information furnished by Jews was by
EnricoFermi(Italian Jew)<
Fermi was not a Jew. His wife was. He left Italy because of the race
laws that Mussolini was forced to implement by Nazi dictate. He joined
Szilard in Columbia university in Manhattan (hence the name "Manhattan
Project"), and then went with hiim to build the reactor in the U of
Chicago. Szilard did most of the thinking and Fermi did most of the
building.
Post by j***@netzero.com
He came up with the detonating devices after
heavy reading of German technical papers stolen by our friends the
Brits. At Columbia university there were thousands of Scientist and
Mathematicians...and a few Jews.. Now typical of all Jews...They now
claim to have invented even oxygen..<
No, the discovery of oxygen was by a Frenchman.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Well Asshole America spent Billions
and used thousands of the finest brains in the world to develope
that.<

The finest brains in the world then were Jewish. All the billions spent
on mediocre brains don't yield much, which is why neither the Germans,
Japanese
nor Russians beat America to the bomb. It was thanks to Jewish
brains coming to America that put the US into first place.
Post by j***@netzero.com
The real contribution to world nuclear devices was the Rosenburgs.
Typical of Jews ..They promptly sold us out to the Russians.<
Since Jews invented it, they can give it to anyone they want.
Your interpretatoin of history is as stupid as you are. EInstein
predicted nuclear energy, and Szilard and Fermi made it happen.
Oppenheimer was the head of the project, and later Ed Teller, another
Hungarian Jew, became father of the US H-bomb. And Admiral Rickover,
another JEw, was the father of the nuclear submarine navy. But you are
correct that Jews gave it to both the US and Russia.
Post by j***@netzero.com
probably another 100,000 or more American GIs
would be laying dead in the soil of Japan right now.
Actaully that is possible...But there was also a plan to starve them out
of Japan.<
That would have taken a long time. Japanese are very industrious and
parsimonious.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
And we are not at war in Iraq. We are in a
terrorist insurgency and are now only backing up the Iraqi police
and military.<
Well, "we" were technically not at war in Korea or in Vietnam either.
The US refuses to lose any more wars, which is why it doesn't declare
war anymore :) If the US wants to win a war, it has to use atomic
bombs, unless you count little conflicts like the first Gulf War.
Not really...We do have things more horrific then nuclear!<
Yeah, you :)
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
You have noticed the sad losses of many Iraqi police
and military? And if we send more troops... How about we also
squash that shithole that started this stuff in the first
palce...Israel!!!<
Yeah, go quit Iraq and take on ISrael.Sure, why not? How about
practicing on North Korea first? They only have six atomic bombs.
Actually none of the above is scary... A walk in the park if the
word is given for a real war with no limits on us. We could have smoked
both Korea and VietNam if the Rules of engagement were not skewed by
idiots.<
I agree with you. Had MacArthur nuked the Chinese on the other side of
the Yalu in 1950, none of the rest since then would have happened. Not
Vietnam, not the Cuban crisis, nada had the commies learned early on
that the US will nuke any aggressor anywhere. But I agree, that
bleeding heart leftist Jewish liberals did keep the Cold War going for
decades because of their leftist leanings. But many of them, myself
included, subesequently having seen the light became "neocons." But
now, you American Nazi types are now critical of right wing Jews. The
simple fact is, your type should have gone to Germany in 1940 and
fought on the side you believed in then, and now. Any side the Jew wil
take will be the side you're against no matter what.

Most of those idiot by the way were Jews. Kissinger and
Post by j***@netzero.com
McNamara <
McNamara was a Jew? News to me. But who knows? Apparently lots of Irish
are becoming Jews lately.
Post by j***@netzero.com
were directly responsible for many many of our losses.
If it had not been for them ...Israel would already be a smoking hole in
the ground for its atrocities in 1967 against American servicemen,
executed Egyptians .. Lebanese, Syrians...Where should I stop?<
The US had no business in the Middle East unless it was helping ISrael.
IF it was not helping ISrael, it had no business being in the region.
Oil can be bought on the free open market. If it wants to interfere in
a region just for the hell of it, it should stick to SOuth America and
other places in AMerica's back yard.
So, if it wasn't helping Israel in 1967, it had no business sending a
spy ship there! Why is Germany and Poland, and Japan and Italy and
other former enemies in NATO, SEATO or otherwise under the nuclear
umbrella of the US
while Israel isn't? I'll tell you why. It's because pro-Nazis like you
were very numerous in the State Dep't and the DoD, which is why Israel
developed its own nuclear deterrent without US help. So if the Liberty
was nearly sunk by the Israelis, and 34 US Navy sailors died, it was
because of pro-Arab Nazis like you who sent it there to spy on Israel
while it was fighting all alone against 5 Arab aggressors backed by the
Soviet Union. Pro-Arab Nazis like you in the NSA that are responsible
for the deaths of those sailors.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
and the logistics to support
them. But we really don't need any troops to eliminate Israel! All
we
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
have to do is stop its allowance and turn our backs. Are you really
so stupid and vain as to believe that The Arabs wouldn't have
overrun your shitty little state long ago, if not for the
interventions
Post by Don Ocean
of Great Britain and America?<
Bullshit. Until 1967 Israel did just fine without US weapons or
much aid. The problems for Israel really started
Post by Don Ocean
Really? And can you name the manufacturer of the weapons you used.<
Not "me" but Israel. But sure, in the 1948 war most arms came from
Russia, mainly via Czechoslovakia, and the Israelis also managed to get
some WWII leftover junk. STalin was pissed at the Jews after 1948 when
despite giving the ISraelis arms, the ISraelis didn't make a flat out
pro-Stalinist communist state, and turned mainly towards the West.
As for the 1956 and 1967 wars, most of its first line fighters were
made by Dassault (a French Jew btw), such as the Mystere in 1956 and
the Mirage in 1967. While the ISraelis did use some modified WWII
vintagee Sherman tanks and half-tracks, most of its first line battle
tanks in 1967 were British Centurions.
I guess you forgot about the Bradleys.. Israel favorite armorat that
time!<

Which Bradley is that? Not the ones now getting routinely blown up in
Iraq? Perhaps you mean the WWII half-tracks that the Israelis used to
transport their infantry? BTW, when the Israelis ordered Bradleys for
the Israeli army, they had them upgraded to Israel specifications.
Israelis don't sent their kids to be blown up in under-protected,
thin-armored cheapie versions that the US sent its own soldiers into
Iraq with! Unlike the WASP elite officer brass of the US military that
care only about their own careers alone, like the Ivy league
management-types that they are, the Israelis actually care about their
soldiers. That's about all Israelis care about. In fact, when the
brouhaha finally came to the surface a year or so ago, the US military
diverted the more expensive, better version Bradleys designated for
Israel to Iraq, and finally started up-armoring them to ISraeli specs.

But getting back to the old half tracks, those were discarded by the US
as it was transitioning to APC's. The Israelis also used civilian buses
too, some made by Volvo :) But it was British Centurion tanks that were
the ones that sliced through the Egypt's Russian T-55's, some of which
were turned over later to the DIA
and CIA. Lot of captured materiel was turned over to the US, so that
they could learn about captured Russian equipment, such as the SAM2s.
That was useful for the US air force in Vietnam.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
And you always had American dollars to spend.. Always!! What
American Jews didn't send Our OSS/CIA did.<
While it is true that US economic aid was vital in the first years of
the state to feed the many new penniless immigrants flooding in from
Europe and the Arab countries, there was almost no US arms until
Kennedy sold the sophisticated Hawk AA missiles in 1962,
We picked up lots of M3's from the prisoners we took in 1957..
A few Thompsons and some M1 carbines.. Mortar tubes...Grenades..
some 500 lb bombs... Enough American arms to piss Eisenhower off!
So don't tell me what I saw and didn't see!<
In 1957? You? Where you one of Nasser's Nazis?
Post by j***@netzero.com
mainly out of
fear that Egypt'S Russian bombers might be used to bomb ISrael's
nuclear reactor in Dimona, and that Israel might use nuclear
materials
Post by j***@netzero.com
to attack Egypt first,
You did attack Egypt first.. That try at the Suez canal...All the time
we had made a friend of Nasser and you SOB's sneak attacked and even
murdered Americans.. <
Friends with Nasser? So why did Nasser buy a half billion dollars worth
of arms from the Soviets in 1955?
Didn't matter. The ISraelis made short works of them in 1956 using
French planes.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Isrtael no longer deserves to exist. the world <
Too bad, Nazi! Hitler said the same thing, but look what happened to
him. Bullet into his own head, and poisoned his dog too :) Well, maybe
the dog made it to heaven :)
Post by j***@netzero.com
really should Stick all you assholes on a deserted Island with a
permanent blockade. Just to insure the security of the rest of
Mankind..
Post by j***@netzero.com
Maybe send you the Islamic to paly with you. ;-( After all..you people
stirred them up to grab more of their land!<
Since you can't do shit, I give you permission to rant like a madman
all you want. Just like your Fuehrer. The end is always the same anyway
:)
Post by j***@netzero.com
perhaps with radiological bombs if not atomic
bombs, to take out Egypt's Russian bombers that were seen as a threat
to Dimona and to Israel's cities. But before 1962 there was a pretty
strict embargo on US arms sales to both Israel and the Arabs. Even
after 1962 there were few US arms sales, mostly ammunition, despite
ISraeli pleas to purchase US F-4 Phantom fighters. Those were finally
sold AFTER Israel already defeated the Arabs in 1967,
You bastards did not defeat the Arabs ... You murdered them in a sneak
attack to steal land and water. You murdered an American ship and 2
observer teams to cover your bloody asses! And your still doing the same
damned thing today. No non-Jew is safe from you scum. And you would
murder even your own people to gain a dime!<
Maybe you should go to Paraguay. Are there any Nazis left there for you
to reminisce with? You need a good beer-buddy to cry into your beer
with.
...
Post by j***@netzero.com
against countries that were not at> war with you... You siezed control
of the fresh water sources.<
Syria was trying to divert water all along to try to cut Israel off.
Anyhow, the Golan was first mentioned in the Bible, was originally
supposed to be in the British Mandate, but they gave it to France, and
so Syria shouldn't have had it in the first place. All they made out of
the Golan was a fortified hell. The Israelis turned it into another
garden spot.
Ya right...The Jews are Gods people Bullshit again!<
Show me ANY reference anywhere to the GOLAN HEIGHTS before it was
mentioned in OUR JEWISHI BIBLE!
If you do, let that country have it! It says clearly in the bible that
Hamat HaGa'der (in the Golan Heights) was to be the northern border of
the land God gave to Moses! Not the whole Golan, but up to Hamat
HaGa'der.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
When our
President Eisenhower told you in 1957 to give back what you had
stolen... Your leaders basically told him to go fuck himself..<
Hey, Kruschev was threatening to nuke Israel with rockets too!
Israel wasn't worth rocketing and we really should have paid the
Russians to remove Israel the pimple on our ass!
So what?
That's why Israel (with French help) developed its own nukes and IRBM
missiles capable of hitting the southern part of the Soviet Union too.
Actually they stole and bribed for American technology.. If you were
so fucking smart.. You would have made cars and not tanks.<
Israel tried to make cars, but it was not financially successful in
such a small market. It's better at making tanks. Anyhow, the Israelis
had to use German engines in their home-grown Sabra cars,
and now use US Chrysler engines in their Merkava tanks :) The same
ones used in the Abams M1A2 tanks. Whether its cars, tanks or
airplanes, engine manufacturing requires lots of capital, and Israel
learned
the hard way that it did not pay to make engines. It's own
engine-making factories were always money-losing,
state-funded enterprises, but they kept one running just for security
purposes, though most of the workers are paid just to play chess with
each other all day :)
However, Israeli companies do make all kinds of parts, for both
military and civilian automotive purposes. So while it doesn't build
entire engines, it makes nearly all the parts to refit virtually any
engine, military or commercial, used by Israelis. And so, if Israel
were subjected to international boycott, it would take many, many years
to bring Israel down. In fact, such boycotts haven't done much to
bring down Cuba, Iran or North Korea, so I doubt Israel would suffer
all that unduly for a long while.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Made peace and not war...The entire history of the Jews is war
and strife.. Now Why is that? And you wonder why we would like
to eliminate you and have peace on earth!<
Is that why you eliminated the Indians, the aborigines, and many
others, just for peace? Yes, a piece of this
continent, a piece of that continent, a piece of every continent you
could steal from its natives by force of arms..
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
That is when overt American aid was withdrawn. The Democrats gave it
back to you even though you were murdering Americans back
then.(Fucking
Post by j***@netzero.com
New York Jewish Politicians).<
That isn't true. There was no military aid to speak of, and only a bit
of economic aid before 1967. If anything, it was Russia in 1948, and
France after 1954 and before 1967 that helped Israel get by more than
the US at that time.
Yes! It is well known that you bastards were so damned greedy that you
were playing everybody!<
Yes, we play everybody. Why not? Everybody tries to play us.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
LBJ failed to run for office in 1968 due to his
fuckup in not bombing you bastards into dust for the attack on the US
ship(USS Liberty) in 1967. That bastard McNamara bailed out as
Secretary of Defense that had covered up the Jewish atrocity. His
reward was a fast promotion to head the world bank.. It is rumored that
certain American military intell services had put out a hit on him..<
Do you work for Al-Jazeera? You should because your take on
history
Post by j***@netzero.com
is, well, so Arab :)
No...so Gentile... The Selfsame Gentiles you bastards have been
murdering and stealing from!
Post by Don Ocean
McNamara
never went anywhere to this day without heavy duty bodyguards. The
fucking Jews just love him...Just like they love Jonathon Pollard!
Many of the old boys in our military would revelle in seeing Israel
pay the price in blood for blood! That is your old testament law
of"an eye for an eye"!<
Antisemitism in the US state department and DoD was hardly news to most
Jews and Israelis.<
There it comes...the rancid charge of antisemitism! <
A rose by any other name is still the same. Call it what you want; it's
Jew-hatred either way. You ask why
so few Jews enroll in the army? Why should they, to get wankered by all
the gentiles who will fuck them over?
Nobody who is sane goes where they aren't wanted and put down, but then
that would mean Jews could not go anywhere if they didn't have some
chutzpeh (hubris).
Post by j***@netzero.com
Every time
a Jew commits crimes against humanity and gets chastised or
even chided for it...*ITS ANTISEMITISM!*.. Hey Sport...Its not
us murdering Semite Arabs... Its *YOU*! <
Guess who eliminated flogging on US ships in the early 19th century? A
Jewish Admiral whose name
escapes me at the moment, Uriah Something. The only crime of Jews was
being weak, timid and too good-hearted,and that is what made them prey
for predators like you over the centuries. What predators like you and
your Aryan and Arab Nazi friends hate is when suddenly the tables are
turned, and they become the prey instead of the predator!
Post by j***@netzero.com
And America must take all
steps to protect itself from the JEWS. They have proven opver
and over that they are America's worst enemy!
Despite it all, Israel prevailed. Anyway, the
Talmud says that "eye for an eye" should be interpreted as monetary
compensation for accidentally taking out an eye, or else nearly
everyone would be half-blind. Jewish law did not remain stuck in desert
tribal law.
Actually that is not what your military staff of the 1950's said..so
what Talmud were they reading! Again Read Moshe Dayans book!<
Actually, Moshe Dayan is no hero of mine. He was a leftwing, adultering
liar and thief, and his son and daughter were worse - insipid,
self-loathing Leftists. But he was a good general, and unfortunately,
as with many good generals, their personal traits whicht make them wily
and effective commanders don't necessarily always play out well in
private life. But the only enemy worse than Nazis and Arab
islamofascists are Leftist Jews. And if Israel is ever destroyed again,
it will be mostly they who have taken it apart. In fact, I always wrote
here on this forum, that peace will destroy Israel because that's when
the Civil War begins. The Arabs have been using the wrong strategy all
along. Had they given Israel peace and left it alone, it would have
self-destructed sooner. It's the constant wars and terror that has
forced Israel to remain united under pressure. Take away the external
pressure and it explodes. SO keep up the war and antisemitism; it makes
us stronger.
Don Ocean
2005-05-05 22:27:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
Don Ocean wrote:...
Actually, it was about 15 million in WWII,
Nope.... 20 million..check the records at the library of congress and
the archives pf the Veterans adminstration.<
Never heard that figure, 12-15 milliion being the figures I've read.
You're the first I've ever heard claiming
20 milllion.
Post by j***@netzero.com
including half a million Jews,<
Actually 152,000 and most had to be drafted.. The Jews were pretty
chintzy about helping fund the underground railway in Europe also!<
The figure I've always heard was half a million. Fifteen million
non-JEws, which then was ten percent of the
population, and half million Jews or 10% of the American Jewish
population. Which book is the source of your figures again?
As for most Jews having to be drafted, that may be so.
I don't know. Most GEntile Americans had to be drafted too. In all the
wars up to and including WWII, American Jews generally went to war in
the same proportion as the rest of the population. This changed when
college students were exempted from the draft, as in Vietnam.
Post by j***@netzero.com
but most of the really tough fighting was done by the Russians
and the Chinese,<
Yep! no argument there.. And done with American logistics and
lendlease.<
I know. My father was fought from Leninigrad to Berlin and killed a few
Nazis on the way.
Post by j***@netzero.com
both of whom lost 20 million each. But the US forces
definitely did tip the balance against the Axis. THe role of the
Chinese in tying down 60%
...> Anyhow, if the JEws hadn't given the US the edge in getting
Post by j***@netzero.com
the atomic bomb first,
The Jews were paid hired hands and not one fucking Jew invented
cutting edge technology..<
Bullshit. Jews practically invented nuclear physics.
Post by j***@netzero.com
We were well aware of Atomic reactions since the 1800's.<
The theory of the atomic nature of matter hardly existed until well
late in the 1880s. And Einstein's famous 1905 equation equating mass
and energy (E=mc^2) was the first insight into the amount and
possibiity of changing mass directly into energy since the time of
medieval alchemists, and Leo Szilard was the first to imagine (and
patent in England) how a nuclear chain reaction could be made possible,
and how to control it. It is true that the Germans first actually split
the atom in 1939, but that is exactly the event that made Szilard round
up Einstein in Princeton, and got Edward Teller to chauffeur the both
of them to see FDR, to persuade him to start a nuclear program. With
the generous $6,000 that Roosevelt gave Szilard, he called in his
Italian mechanic, Enrico Fermi, from Italy to join him in Columbia
university (in Manhattan, hence "Manhattan Project," and they went on
from there to the University of Chicao to build the first little
functioning graphite-based nuclear reactor - the very first nuclear
reactor in history. Hence the theory
was confirmed. From there to a bomb I admit required a helluva lot of
good engineering.The Germans gave up on graphite, but Szilard insisted,
and Szilard proved right, which is why the US got a quantum leap over
Germany towards an atomic bomb. As for practical bomb technology
itself, that was a different matter and
I agree that Jews were less involved in the engineering, except for
maybe Oppenheimer the director of the
entire bomb project. I don't know much about the nuts and bolts part.
I leave that to the nuts and the dolts :)
Post by j***@netzero.com
Germanys heavy water research and race to develope a
bomb is what motivated America to invest heavily and steal the fire
from Germany. <
You are so ass-backwards you've GOT to be an Arab! The Germans turned
to heavy water because they
gave up on graphite. But when graphite did not work well in the US,
Szilard insisted that it wasn't pure enough.
The Germans believe deeply in their own test instruments; Szilard
believed deeply in his own brain. He won.
Post by j***@netzero.com
The only real information furnished by Jews was by
EnricoFermi(Italian Jew)<
Fermi was not a Jew. His wife was. He left Italy because of the race
laws that Mussolini was forced to implement by Nazi dictate. He joined
Szilard in Columbia university in Manhattan (hence the name "Manhattan
Project"), and then went with hiim to build the reactor in the U of
Chicago. Szilard did most of the thinking and Fermi did most of the
building.
Post by j***@netzero.com
He came up with the detonating devices after
heavy reading of German technical papers stolen by our friends the
Brits. At Columbia university there were thousands of Scientist and
Mathematicians...and a few Jews.. Now typical of all Jews...They now
claim to have invented even oxygen..<
No, the discovery of oxygen was by a Frenchman.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Well Asshole America spent Billions
and used thousands of the finest brains in the world to develope
that.<
The finest brains in the world then were Jewish. All the billions spent
on mediocre brains don't yield much, which is why neither the Germans,
Japanese
nor Russians beat America to the bomb. It was thanks to Jewish
brains coming to America that put the US into first place.
Post by j***@netzero.com
The real contribution to world nuclear devices was the Rosenburgs.
Typical of Jews ..They promptly sold us out to the Russians.<
Since Jews invented it, they can give it to anyone they want.
Your interpretatoin of history is as stupid as you are. EInstein
predicted nuclear energy, and Szilard and Fermi made it happen.
Oppenheimer was the head of the project, and later Ed Teller, another
Hungarian Jew, became father of the US H-bomb. And Admiral Rickover,
another JEw, was the father of the nuclear submarine navy. But you are
correct that Jews gave it to both the US and Russia.
Post by j***@netzero.com
probably another 100,000 or more American GIs
would be laying dead in the soil of Japan right now.
Actaully that is possible...But there was also a plan to starve them
out
Post by j***@netzero.com
of Japan.<
That would have taken a long time. Japanese are very industrious and
parsimonious.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
And we are not at war in Iraq. We are in a
terrorist insurgency and are now only backing up the Iraqi police
and military.<
Well, "we" were technically not at war in Korea or in Vietnam
either.
Post by j***@netzero.com
The US refuses to lose any more wars, which is why it doesn't
declare
Post by j***@netzero.com
war anymore :) If the US wants to win a war, it has to use atomic
bombs, unless you count little conflicts like the first Gulf War.
Not really...We do have things more horrific then nuclear!<
Yeah, you :)
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
You have noticed the sad losses of many Iraqi police
and military? And if we send more troops... How about we also
squash that shithole that started this stuff in the first
palce...Israel!!!<
Yeah, go quit Iraq and take on ISrael.Sure, why not? How about
practicing on North Korea first? They only have six atomic bombs.
Actually none of the above is scary... A walk in the park if the
word is given for a real war with no limits on us. We could have
smoked
Post by j***@netzero.com
both Korea and VietNam if the Rules of engagement were not skewed by
idiots.<
I agree with you. Had MacArthur nuked the Chinese on the other side of
the Yalu in 1950, none of the rest since then would have happened. Not
Vietnam, not the Cuban crisis, nada had the commies learned early on
that the US will nuke any aggressor anywhere. But I agree, that
bleeding heart leftist Jewish liberals did keep the Cold War going for
decades because of their leftist leanings. But many of them, myself
included, subesequently having seen the light became "neocons." But
now, you American Nazi types are now critical of right wing Jews. The
simple fact is, your type should have gone to Germany in 1940 and
fought on the side you believed in then, and now. Any side the Jew wil
take will be the side you're against no matter what.
Most of those idiot by the way were Jews. Kissinger and
Post by j***@netzero.com
McNamara <
McNamara was a Jew? News to me. But who knows? Apparently lots of Irish
are becoming Jews lately.
Post by j***@netzero.com
were directly responsible for many many of our losses.
If it had not been for them ...Israel would already be a smoking hole
in
Post by j***@netzero.com
the ground for its atrocities in 1967 against American servicemen,
executed Egyptians .. Lebanese, Syrians...Where should I stop?<
The US had no business in the Middle East unless it was helping ISrael.
IF it was not helping ISrael, it had no business being in the region.
Oil can be bought on the free open market. If it wants to interfere in
a region just for the hell of it, it should stick to SOuth America and
other places in AMerica's back yard.
So, if it wasn't helping Israel in 1967, it had no business sending a
spy ship there! Why is Germany and Poland, and Japan and Italy and
other former enemies in NATO, SEATO or otherwise under the nuclear
umbrella of the US
while Israel isn't? I'll tell you why. It's because pro-Nazis like you
were very numerous in the State Dep't and the DoD, which is why Israel
developed its own nuclear deterrent without US help. So if the Liberty
was nearly sunk by the Israelis, and 34 US Navy sailors died, it was
because of pro-Arab Nazis like you who sent it there to spy on Israel
while it was fighting all alone against 5 Arab aggressors backed by the
Soviet Union. Pro-Arab Nazis like you in the NSA that are responsible
for the deaths of those sailors.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
and the logistics to support
them. But we really don't need any troops to eliminate Israel!
All
Post by j***@netzero.com
we
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
have to do is stop its allowance and turn our backs. Are you
really
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
Post by Don Ocean
so stupid and vain as to believe that The Arabs wouldn't have
overrun your shitty little state long ago, if not for the
interventions
Post by Don Ocean
of Great Britain and America?<
Bullshit. Until 1967 Israel did just fine without US weapons or
much aid. The problems for Israel really started
Post by Don Ocean
Really? And can you name the manufacturer of the weapons you used.<
Not "me" but Israel. But sure, in the 1948 war most arms came from
Russia, mainly via Czechoslovakia, and the Israelis also managed to
get
Post by j***@netzero.com
some WWII leftover junk. STalin was pissed at the Jews after 1948
when
Post by j***@netzero.com
despite giving the ISraelis arms, the ISraelis didn't make a flat
out
Post by j***@netzero.com
pro-Stalinist communist state, and turned mainly towards the West.
As for the 1956 and 1967 wars, most of its first line fighters were
made by Dassault (a French Jew btw), such as the Mystere in 1956
and
Post by j***@netzero.com
the Mirage in 1967. While the ISraelis did use some modified WWII
vintagee Sherman tanks and half-tracks, most of its first line
battle
Post by j***@netzero.com
tanks in 1967 were British Centurions.
I guess you forgot about the Bradleys.. Israel favorite armorat that
time!<
Which Bradley is that? Not the ones now getting routinely blown up in
Iraq? Perhaps you mean the WWII half-tracks that the Israelis used to
transport their infantry? BTW, when the Israelis ordered Bradleys for
the Israeli army, they had them upgraded to Israel specifications.
Israelis don't sent their kids to be blown up in under-protected,
thin-armored cheapie versions that the US sent its own soldiers into
Iraq with! Unlike the WASP elite officer brass of the US military that
care only about their own careers alone, like the Ivy league
management-types that they are, the Israelis actually care about their
soldiers. That's about all Israelis care about. In fact, when the
brouhaha finally came to the surface a year or so ago, the US military
diverted the more expensive, better version Bradleys designated for
Israel to Iraq, and finally started up-armoring them to ISraeli specs.
But getting back to the old half tracks, those were discarded by the US
as it was transitioning to APC's. The Israelis also used civilian buses
too, some made by Volvo :) But it was British Centurion tanks that were
the ones that sliced through the Egypt's Russian T-55's, some of which
were turned over later to the DIA
and CIA. Lot of captured materiel was turned over to the US, so that
they could learn about captured Russian equipment, such as the SAM2s.
That was useful for the US air force in Vietnam.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
And you always had American dollars to spend.. Always!! What
American Jews didn't send Our OSS/CIA did.<
While it is true that US economic aid was vital in the first years
of
Post by j***@netzero.com
the state to feed the many new penniless immigrants flooding in
from
Post by j***@netzero.com
Europe and the Arab countries, there was almost no US arms until
Kennedy sold the sophisticated Hawk AA missiles in 1962,
We picked up lots of M3's from the prisoners we took in 1957..
A few Thompsons and some M1 carbines.. Mortar tubes...Grenades..
some 500 lb bombs... Enough American arms to piss Eisenhower off!
So don't tell me what I saw and didn't see!<
In 1957? You? Where you one of Nasser's Nazis?
Post by j***@netzero.com
mainly out of
fear that Egypt'S Russian bombers might be used to bomb ISrael's
nuclear reactor in Dimona, and that Israel might use nuclear
materials
Post by j***@netzero.com
to attack Egypt first,
You did attack Egypt first.. That try at the Suez canal...All the
time
Post by j***@netzero.com
we had made a friend of Nasser and you SOB's sneak attacked and even
murdered Americans.. <
Friends with Nasser? So why did Nasser buy a half billion dollars worth
of arms from the Soviets in 1955?
Didn't matter. The ISraelis made short works of them in 1956 using
French planes.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Isrtael no longer deserves to exist. the world <
Too bad, Nazi! Hitler said the same thing, but look what happened to
him. Bullet into his own head, and poisoned his dog too :) Well, maybe
the dog made it to heaven :)
Post by j***@netzero.com
really should Stick all you assholes on a deserted Island with a
permanent blockade. Just to insure the security of the rest of
Mankind..
Post by j***@netzero.com
Maybe send you the Islamic to paly with you. ;-( After all..you
people
Post by j***@netzero.com
stirred them up to grab more of their land!<
Since you can't do shit, I give you permission to rant like a madman
all you want. Just like your Fuehrer. The end is always the same anyway
:)
Post by j***@netzero.com
perhaps with radiological bombs if not atomic
bombs, to take out Egypt's Russian bombers that were seen as a
threat
Post by j***@netzero.com
to Dimona and to Israel's cities. But before 1962 there was a
pretty
Post by j***@netzero.com
strict embargo on US arms sales to both Israel and the Arabs. Even
after 1962 there were few US arms sales, mostly ammunition, despite
ISraeli pleas to purchase US F-4 Phantom fighters. Those were
finally
Post by j***@netzero.com
sold AFTER Israel already defeated the Arabs in 1967,
You bastards did not defeat the Arabs ... You murdered them in a
sneak
Post by j***@netzero.com
attack to steal land and water. You murdered an American ship and 2
observer teams to cover your bloody asses! And your still doing the
same
Post by j***@netzero.com
damned thing today. No non-Jew is safe from you scum. And you would
murder even your own people to gain a dime!<
Maybe you should go to Paraguay. Are there any Nazis left there for you
to reminisce with? You need a good beer-buddy to cry into your beer
with.
...
Post by j***@netzero.com
against countries that were not at> war with you... You siezed
control
Post by j***@netzero.com
of the fresh water sources.<
Syria was trying to divert water all along to try to cut Israel
off.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Anyhow, the Golan was first mentioned in the Bible, was originally
supposed to be in the British Mandate, but they gave it to France,
and
Post by j***@netzero.com
so Syria shouldn't have had it in the first place. All they made
out of
Post by j***@netzero.com
the Golan was a fortified hell. The Israelis turned it into another
garden spot.
Ya right...The Jews are Gods people Bullshit again!<
Show me ANY reference anywhere to the GOLAN HEIGHTS before it was
mentioned in OUR JEWISHI BIBLE!
If you do, let that country have it! It says clearly in the bible that
Hamat HaGa'der (in the Golan Heights) was to be the northern border of
the land God gave to Moses! Not the whole Golan, but up to Hamat
HaGa'der.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
When our
President Eisenhower told you in 1957 to give back what you had
stolen... Your leaders basically told him to go fuck himself..<
Hey, Kruschev was threatening to nuke Israel with rockets too!
Israel wasn't worth rocketing and we really should have paid the
Russians to remove Israel the pimple on our ass!
So what?
That's why Israel (with French help) developed its own nukes and
IRBM
Post by j***@netzero.com
missiles capable of hitting the southern part of the Soviet Union
too.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Actually they stole and bribed for American technology.. If you were
so fucking smart.. You would have made cars and not tanks.<
Israel tried to make cars, but it was not financially successful in
such a small market. It's better at making tanks. Anyhow, the Israelis
had to use German engines in their home-grown Sabra cars,
and now use US Chrysler engines in their Merkava tanks :) The same
ones used in the Abams M1A2 tanks. Whether its cars, tanks or
airplanes, engine manufacturing requires lots of capital, and Israel
learned
the hard way that it did not pay to make engines. It's own
engine-making factories were always money-losing,
state-funded enterprises, but they kept one running just for security
purposes, though most of the workers are paid just to play chess with
each other all day :)
However, Israeli companies do make all kinds of parts, for both
military and civilian automotive purposes. So while it doesn't build
entire engines, it makes nearly all the parts to refit virtually any
engine, military or commercial, used by Israelis. And so, if Israel
were subjected to international boycott, it would take many, many years
to bring Israel down. In fact, such boycotts haven't done much to
bring down Cuba, Iran or North Korea, so I doubt Israel would suffer
all that unduly for a long while.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Made peace and not war...The entire history of the Jews is war
and strife.. Now Why is that? And you wonder why we would like
to eliminate you and have peace on earth!<
Is that why you eliminated the Indians, the aborigines, and many
others, just for peace? Yes, a piece of this
continent, a piece of that continent, a piece of every continent you
could steal from its natives by force of arms..
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
That is when overt American aid was withdrawn. The Democrats gave
it
Post by j***@netzero.com
back to you even though you were murdering Americans back
then.(Fucking
Post by j***@netzero.com
New York Jewish Politicians).<
That isn't true. There was no military aid to speak of, and only a
bit
Post by j***@netzero.com
of economic aid before 1967. If anything, it was Russia in 1948,
and
Post by j***@netzero.com
France after 1954 and before 1967 that helped Israel get by more
than
Post by j***@netzero.com
the US at that time.
Yes! It is well known that you bastards were so damned greedy that
you
Post by j***@netzero.com
were playing everybody!<
Yes, we play everybody. Why not? Everybody tries to play us.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
LBJ failed to run for office in 1968 due to his
fuckup in not bombing you bastards into dust for the attack on the
US
Post by j***@netzero.com
ship(USS Liberty) in 1967. That bastard McNamara bailed out as
Secretary of Defense that had covered up the Jewish atrocity. His
reward was a fast promotion to head the world bank.. It is rumored
that
Post by j***@netzero.com
certain American military intell services had put out a hit on
him..<
Post by j***@netzero.com
Do you work for Al-Jazeera? You should because your take on
history
Post by j***@netzero.com
is, well, so Arab :)
No...so Gentile... The Selfsame Gentiles you bastards have been
murdering and stealing from!
Post by Don Ocean
McNamara
never went anywhere to this day without heavy duty bodyguards. The
fucking Jews just love him...Just like they love Jonathon Pollard!
Many of the old boys in our military would revelle in seeing Israel
pay the price in blood for blood! That is your old testament law
of"an eye for an eye"!<
Antisemitism in the US state department and DoD was hardly news to
most
Post by j***@netzero.com
Jews and Israelis.<
There it comes...the rancid charge of antisemitism! <
A rose by any other name is still the same. Call it what you want; it's
Jew-hatred either way. You ask why
so few Jews enroll in the army? Why should they, to get wankered by all
the gentiles who will fuck them over?
Nobody who is sane goes where they aren't wanted and put down, but then
that would mean Jews could not go anywhere if they didn't have some
chutzpeh (hubris).
Post by j***@netzero.com
Every time
a Jew commits crimes against humanity and gets chastised or
even chided for it...*ITS ANTISEMITISM!*.. Hey Sport...Its not
us murdering Semite Arabs... Its *YOU*! <
Guess who eliminated flogging on US ships in the early 19th century? A
Jewish Admiral whose name
escapes me at the moment, Uriah Something. The only crime of Jews was
being weak, timid and too good-hearted,and that is what made them prey
for predators like you over the centuries. What predators like you and
your Aryan and Arab Nazi friends hate is when suddenly the tables are
turned, and they become the prey instead of the predator!
Post by j***@netzero.com
And America must take all
steps to protect itself from the JEWS. They have proven opver
and over that they are America's worst enemy!
Despite it all, Israel prevailed. Anyway, the
Talmud says that "eye for an eye" should be interpreted as monetary
compensation for accidentally taking out an eye, or else nearly
everyone would be half-blind. Jewish law did not remain stuck in
desert
Post by j***@netzero.com
tribal law.
Actually that is not what your military staff of the 1950's said..so
what Talmud were they reading! Again Read Moshe Dayans book!<
Actually, Moshe Dayan is no hero of mine. He was a leftwing, adultering
liar and thief, and his son and daughter were worse - insipid,
self-loathing Leftists. But he was a good general, and unfortunately,
as with many good generals, their personal traits whicht make them wily
and effective commanders don't necessarily always play out well in
private life. But the only enemy worse than Nazis and Arab
islamofascists are Leftist Jews. And if Israel is ever destroyed again,
here on this forum, that peace will destroy Israel because that's when
the Civil War begins. The Arabs have been using the wrong strategy all
along. Had they given Israel peace and left it alone, it would have
self-destructed sooner. It's the constant wars and terror that has
forced Israel to remain united under pressure. Take away the external
pressure and it explodes. SO keep up the war and antisemitism; it makes
us stronger.
Don Ocean
2005-05-05 23:46:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
Don Ocean wrote:...
Actually, it was about 15 million in WWII,
Nope.... 20 million..check the records at the library of congress and
the archives pf the Veterans adminstration.<
Never heard that figure, 12-15 milliion being the figures I've read.
You're the first I've ever heard claiming
20 milllion.
Post by j***@netzero.com
including half a million Jews,<
Actually 152,000 and most had to be drafted.. The Jews were pretty
chintzy about helping fund the underground railway in Europe also!<
The figure I've always heard was half a million. Fifteen million
non-JEws, which then was ten percent of the
If that were true...We would have had Jewish divisions such as we
had Japanese divisions.. Very few Jews fought in the pacific. Most Jews
fought or whatever in Italy and foreward. Actuall my source is
Colliers facts and whatever of WWII.. Probably edited by a Jew..
Post by j***@netzero.com
population, and half million Jews or 10% of the American Jewish
population. Which book is the source of your figures again?
As for most Jews having to be drafted, that may be so.
Where I live...They sent folks back home to wait for their enlistment
to be numbered. They only had so many uniforms and training camps.
Omaha was swamped with would be enlisters. Our farms were were
left with women old men and children..plus 4F'ers.. Not a lot of
4F'rs here though. They actually signed waivers or lied to get in.
Jack Elbey signed a waiver and hoined with one eye.. Didn't need to
go.
Post by j***@netzero.com
I don't know. Most GEntile Americans had to be drafted too. In all the
wars up to and including WWII, American Jews generally went to war in
the same proportion as the rest of the population. This changed when
college students were exempted from the draft, as in Vietnam.
I noticed the strife on campus...So that was Jewish inspired too? I
should have guessed.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
but most of the really tough fighting was done by the Russians
and the Chinese,<
Yep! no argument there.. And done with American logistics and
lendlease.<
I know. My father was fought from Leninigrad to Berlin and killed a few
Nazis on the way.
Post by j***@netzero.com
both of whom lost 20 million each. But the US forces
definitely did tip the balance against the Axis. THe role of the
Chinese in tying down 60%
...> Anyhow, if the JEws hadn't given the US the edge in getting
Post by j***@netzero.com
the atomic bomb first,
The Jews were paid hired hands and not one fucking Jew invented
cutting edge technology..<
Bullshit. Jews practically invented nuclear physics.
You better research that a bit better. WQhy is the Jews are
so anally Retentive that they must claim credit for everything
and that everything of value belongs to them?

***********************************************************
NAA hires 142,000 people to research and develope a system to
get men to the moon. Hundreds of $billions are spent.. Several
years of cutting edge research is accomplished! Thousands of
inventions from small to massive brakthroughs are developed in
this team effort.. Of course the inventions and the technology
belong to the American taxpayer.. They paid for it! Does Werner
Von Braun take all the credit for his rocketry.. Nope! Not by a
long shot. One Jew pops up and says he is an Engineer that worked on
that project and that we never achieved that goal of getting to the
moon. Of the 21 of us that were there in that area..There was one
American Jew and he had a heart attack halfway through the project.
None of us have ever heard of this other fellow. So who do you
believe? 142,000 folks that put Apollo up or one Jew that nobody can
place. By the way the Jew that died was in Italy WWII and a fine fellow
He raised Orchids in Fountain Valley California for a Hobby and wrote
excellent papers in Astrophysics.. But he was a *TEAM* member... Just
as was the handful of Jews that serve on the huge manpower team of
the Manhattan project. Hell, You probably think that even Sandia is
part of Israel! My God...Do you really think that nobody can get along
or invent/develope things without a Jewish hand in it.. Serbians
Marisa Einstien and Nicola Testla actually did most of what Jews like
to take credit for. Even your best Jewish Scientists studied at the
knee of German professors at the Suis Teknikal Akademy. The best
codebrakers in the world were non-Jew brits.. Yet I hear amazing
claims of how the Jews did it.. Give it a break Buz! Some Jews have
fine minds and actually use them for good.. But keep in mind...So do
Gentiles of many nations.. Open a book of the breakthroughs in Science
etc through the Centuries and see for you self! We knew about the
amazing atom since the 1800's and earlier. The bible for Laser science
was written in 1924.. long before we developed the hardware to build
one. MIT wrote the Radlab series(a complete research of Microwaves)
during WWII. We are still developing things from that set of books.
Magnetics and high voltage go back to Maxwell, Planck, Oerstead,
Testla and dozens of others.. We are still developing items from the
research in the 1700's and the 1800's. Even a Canadian hired gun worked
out a magnetic cannon for Iraq.. Sadly the Jews assassinated him instead
of just stopping him. I wonder how much knowledge was either stolen or
eliminated by those assassins?
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
We were well aware of Atomic reactions since the 1800's.<
The theory of the atomic nature of matter hardly existed until well
late in the 1880s. And Einstein's famous 1905 equation equating mass
and energy (E=mc^2)
That was Mrs Einstein(A Serbian) and was developed a year or 2 before
she met Einstein.. When Einstein dumped his wife and daughter..He stated
flatly that he had never met an uglier woman.. So you tell me... What
was his motives in marrying her. He got the Nobel prize, but she
demanded and got the money after she agreed never to expose him(FACT!)
That Theory was developed by her with an elderly physics professor
at the Suise Akademy!

was the first insight into the amount and
Post by j***@netzero.com
possibiity of changing mass directly into energy since the time of
medieval alchemists, and Leo Szilard was the first to imagine (and
patent in England)
how a nuclear chain reaction could be made possible,
Post by j***@netzero.com
and how to control it.
Actually the first reaction was a bedspring reaction at Columbia
Universities Squash court. And Lizard naysayed it..saying it would
react with all atoms and possibly destroy the earth. By the way
that squash court is now a rose Garden and still hot!
You are aware of the thousands that worked on that project.

It is true that the Germans first actually split
Post by j***@netzero.com
the atom in 1939, but that is exactly the event that made Szilard round
up Einstein in Princeton, and got Edward Teller to chauffeur the both
of them to see FDR, to persuade him to start a nuclear program. With
the generous $6,000 that Roosevelt gave Szilard, he called in his
Italian mechanic, Enrico Fermi,
I understand Fermi was already teaching in America due to his Antifacist
stand in Italy... Nice try.. And Fermi was not all Jewish. Cripes
Where do you get this garbage.

from Italy to join him in Columbia
Post by j***@netzero.com
university (in Manhattan, hence "Manhattan Project," and they went on
from there to the University of Chicao to build the first little
functioning graphite-based nuclear reactor - the very first nuclear
reactor in history. Hence the theory
I already pooh poohed that... it was at Columbia!
Post by j***@netzero.com
was confirmed. From there to a bomb I admit required a helluva lot of
good engineering.The Germans gave up on graphite, but Szilard insisted,
and Szilard proved right, which is why the US got a quantum leap over
Germany towards an atomic bomb. As for practical bomb technology
itself, that was a different matter and
I agree that Jews were less involved in the engineering, except for
maybe Oppenheimer the director of the
entire bomb project. I don't know much about the nuts and bolts part.
I leave that to the nuts and the dolts :)
I and thousands of others have the capabilities to produce such..With
oodles of money and help.. It is no longer out of reach of the average
high school student! Only the first detonators were edgy and crude.
Very easy to put together a detonator today. Just lots of money and
access to certain element etc. Logistics and safety of personal are the
prime problems now. The materials no longer need to be refined. They are
refined as part of the reaction.. Quite cheap in comparison with
yesterdays nukes.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
Germanys heavy water research and race to develope a
bomb is what motivated America to invest heavily and steal the fire
from Germany. <
You are so ass-backwards you've GOT to be an Arab! The Germans turned
to heavy water because they
gave up on graphite. But when graphite did not work well in the US,
Szilard insisted that it wasn't pure enough.
The Germans believe deeply in their own test instruments; Szilard
believed deeply in his own brain. He won.
Germany lost the race because the Jews stole their technology and
Anerica and England Bombed their researchers into dust. Von Braun
for instance(Rocketry) was a Jr Scientist, But the most senior survivor!
Is it so hard for you as a jew to give Germany the credit it deserves.
When was the last time that a bunch of Jews got together and built
universities of higher learning that are renowned worldwide?
Germany, Switzerland, America, and England did! Jews became the
students... And now the students want the credit for what they were
taught. Fah!! You people will never change.. The greed covers
everything from knowledge to money.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
The only real information furnished by Jews was by
EnricoFermi(Italian Jew)<
Fermi was not a Jew. His wife was. He left Italy because of the race
laws that Mussolini was forced to implement by Nazi dictate. He joined
Szilard in Columbia university in Manhattan (hence the name "Manhattan
Project"), and then went with hiim to build the reactor in the U of
Chicago. Szilard did most of the thinking and Fermi did most of the
building.
I wish you would make up your mind how and why Enrico was here.. And
yes Enrico was part Jew...That is how he married an orthodox Jewess.
Damned.. Your thicker then a Demopcrat! ;--p0
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
He came up with the detonating devices after
heavy reading of German technical papers stolen by our friends the
Brits. At Columbia university there were thousands of Scientist and
Mathematicians...and a few Jews.. Now typical of all Jews...They now
claim to have invented even oxygen..<
No, the discovery of oxygen was by a Frenchman.
Wow! I was sure that you were going to claim ownership of it
because a Jew invented it! By the way discovering and inventing are
2 different things.. Its like Columbus claimed to have discovered and
claimed America.. Eric the Red had been here hundreds of years earlier
and America already had a population in ownership! Plus the fact that
Columbus never got near modern day America.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
Well Asshole America spent Billions
and used thousands of the finest brains in the world to develope
that.<
The finest brains in the world then were Jewish. All the billions spent
on mediocre brains don't yield much, which is why neither the Germans,
Japanese
nor Russians beat America to the bomb. It was thanks to Jewish
brains coming to America that put the US into first place.
I guess Hitler was stoking the fires with the brightest that were too
dumb to haul ass when he warned them in 1933. By the way the highest
scores at MENSA are Russian and German.. I don't hold much truk with
that...But you insist on insulting this ole country boys 3rd grade
education! ;-p
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
The real contribution to world nuclear devices was the Rosenburgs.
Typical of Jews ..They promptly sold us out to the Russians.<
Since Jews invented it, they can give it to anyone they want.
That attitude is why I am pushing for execution of any Jew that
crosses America.. In fact I am pushing for all Jews with even a snuffle
of Israel to be expelled promptly for the good of the nation..
J Edgar Hoover had you peopl;e right!
Post by j***@netzero.com
Your interpretatoin of history is as stupid as you are. EInstein
predicted nuclear energy, and Szilard and Fermi made it happen.
Oppenheimer was the head of the project, and later Ed Teller, another
Hungarian Jew, became father of the US H-bomb. And Admiral Rickover,
another JEw,
I admire Rickover...He demanded that we do something about Israel
attacking the USS Liberty as did another all-American Jew..Barry
GoldWater.. MCNamara over-ruled that! Rickover did a fine job
of being a manager of the people that developed the nuclear
submarine fleet... He had absolutely nothing to do with the
Nautilus and the first nuke boats.. And nothing to do with the
surface fleet. I met the little fuck in Groton Connecticut years
back.. He was alright. But the overall technaical aspects were
think tanks and team efforts... Jews did not prevail ...Except in your
greedy grubby mind. Ummm? If Jews are the brains of the earth...Why are
you wasting time with me... Why ain't you out inventing a cage to
capture a flying saucer or something.. Your probably into literature or
art. Cuase you sure as hell are in the dark on the Sciences,,,
Just the opinion of a poor ole country boy that never bin out in the
real Jewish world! ;-p

was the father of the nuclear submarine navy. But you are
Post by j***@netzero.com
correct that Jews gave it to both the US and Russia.
Hope that I never get into power... I will eliminate the
danger that you people present to the world.. Could it be
that Hitler had it right and we fucked up a good thing.
Damned that Satan!!!!
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
probably another 100,000 or more American GIs
would be laying dead in the soil of Japan right now.
Actaully that is possible...But there was also a plan to starve them
out
Post by j***@netzero.com
of Japan.<
That would have taken a long time. Japanese are very industrious and
parsimonious.
Shows how little you know of that Island empire.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
And we are not at war in Iraq. We are in a
terrorist insurgency and are now only backing up the Iraqi police
and military.<
Well, "we" were technically not at war in Korea or in Vietnam
either.
Don't make any difference what the pols say.. When your in a shooting
match... It is war!
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
The US refuses to lose any more wars, which is why it doesn't
declare
Post by j***@netzero.com
war anymore :) If the US wants to win a war, it has to use atomic
bombs, unless you count little conflicts like the first Gulf War.
Not really...We do have things more horrific then nuclear!<
Yeah, you :)
Biological keeps giving for Centuries and more.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
You have noticed the sad losses of many Iraqi police
and military? And if we send more troops... How about we also
squash that shithole that started this stuff in the first
palce...Israel!!!<
Yeah, go quit Iraq and take on ISrael.Sure, why not? How about
practicing on North Korea first? They only have six atomic bombs.
Actually none of the above is scary... A walk in the park if the
word is given for a real war with no limits on us. We could have
smoked
Post by j***@netzero.com
both Korea and VietNam if the Rules of engagement were not skewed by
idiots.<
I agree with you. Had MacArthur nuked the Chinese on the other side of
the Yalu in 1950, none of the rest since then would have happened. Not
Vietnam, not the Cuban crisis, nada had the commies learned early on
that the US will nuke any aggressor anywhere. But I agree, that
bleeding heart leftist Jewish liberals did keep the Cold War going for
decades because of their leftist leanings. But many of them, myself
included, subesequently having seen the light became "neocons." But
now, you American Nazi types are now critical of right wing Jews. The
simple fact is, your type should have gone to Germany in 1940 and
fought on the side you believed in then, and now. Any side the Jew wil
take will be the side you're against no matter what.
Most of those idiot by the way were Jews. Kissinger and
Post by j***@netzero.com
McNamara <
McNamara was a Jew? News to me. But who knows? Apparently lots of Irish
are becoming Jews lately.
Part Jew... Otherwise he would never have made the world bank job!
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
were directly responsible for many many of our losses.
If it had not been for them ...Israel would already be a smoking hole
in
Post by j***@netzero.com
the ground for its atrocities in 1967 against American servicemen,
executed Egyptians .. Lebanese, Syrians...Where should I stop?<
j***@netzero.com
2005-05-06 17:00:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
The figure I've always heard was half a million. Fifteen million
non-JEws, which then was ten percent of the
If that were true...We would have had Jewish divisions such as we
had Japanese divisions.. <
We (the US) made Japanese units out of those volunteers we interned,
because they wanted to prove themselves, and they certainly did, and
because we wanted to keep them together to keep an eye on them.
Post by Don Ocean
Very few Jews fought in the pacific. Most Jews
fought or whatever in Italy and foreward. <
You may be right. American Jews were concerned about the Germans
murdering their families in Europe, and not about the Japanese. It's
the Chinese who were getting slaughtered by them.


Actuall my source is
Post by Don Ocean
Colliers facts and whatever of WWII.. Probably edited by a Jew..
Post by j***@netzero.com
population, and half million Jews or 10% of the American Jewish
population. Which book is the source of your figures again?
As for most Jews having to be drafted, that may be so.
Where I live...They sent folks back home to wait for their enlistment
to be numbered. They only had so many uniforms and training camps.
Omaha was swamped with would be enlisters. Our farms were were
left with women old men and children..plus 4F'ers.. Not a lot of
4F'rs here though. They actually signed waivers or lied to get in.
Jack Elbey signed a waiver and hoined with one eye.. Didn't need to
go.<
Hey, what else is there when you're from the farm? :) But seriously, I
agree that the Jews who did eagerly enlist in WWII were concerned about
JEws in Europe getting killed, and less about other reasons for the
war. They were less concerned about the millions of Chinese being
slaughtered by the Japanese, or Ukrainians being collectivized and
starved by Stalin, but mainly concerned about their own. Ethnicity is a
strong force, but Leftist Jews never wanted to admit to it. I do admit
to it. Gentiles basically don't care about what happened to the Jews,
and vice versa. I try to be more honest about it. People care most
about "their own" - their own family, their own clan, their own tribe,
their own ethnicity, "breed," etc. It's a fact of life. Liberal Jews
are hypocrites, but most can't admit to it.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
I don't know. Most GEntile Americans had to be drafted too. In all the
wars up to and including WWII, American Jews generally went to war in
the same proportion as the rest of the population. This changed when
college students were exempted from the draft, as in Vietnam.
I noticed the strife on campus...So that was Jewish inspired too? I
should have guessed.<
A lot of it was. As for myself, I was more intellectual about it even
then.One of the first things I remembered as a kid on TV was watching
the surrounding and capture of the French Foreign Legion at
Dienbienphu in 1954, and later on, read books by Bernard Fall about
the Indonchinese war. So, despite helicopters and all, I didn't see
where the US would succeed where the French had failed earlier on. But
much later on, after the war, I realized much better that indeed that
Ho Chi Minh indeed was a commie, and despite all of the talk of a
nationalist civil war, etc., the simple fact was that it was indeed
communist subversion of South Vietnam, but I didn't think we could win
it using conventional means, and
unless we used a nuke on Hanoi, it would all be a waste of American
lives in any case. We can win any conventional war against a
conventional army, but cannot against guerrillas and terrorists because
our democratic televised media will never let use the horrible means
needed to subdue terrorists. We did it in the Phillippines in the
1920s, but there were no TV cameras to show what American troops had to
do
to put down the Filipinos, and the 300,000 deaths we incurred on them.
I realised that with TV cameras we could never win a guerrilla terror
war, so Vietnam was a bloody exercise in futility, and only made
vets like you bitter. And rightly so, because if you go into war, you
have to do what you have to do to win, or get out.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
but most of the really tough fighting was done by the Russians
and the Chinese,<
Yep! no argument there.. And done with American logistics and
lendlease.<
I know. My father was fought from Leninigrad to Berlin and killed a few
Nazis on the way.
Post by j***@netzero.com
both of whom lost 20 million each. But the US forces
definitely did tip the balance against the Axis. THe role of the
Chinese in tying down 60%
...> Anyhow, if the JEws hadn't given the US the edge in getting
Post by j***@netzero.com
the atomic bomb first,
The Jews were paid hired hands and not one fucking Jew invented
cutting edge technology..<
Bullshit. Jews practically invented nuclear physics.
You better research that a bit better. WQhy is the Jews are
so anally Retentive that they must claim credit for everything
and that everything of value belongs to them?<
For the same reasons many Americans think they invented the whole world
:) EVen today Americans forget that Imperial China was the greatest,
richest, and most advanced power on earth decades before Columbus
sailed the ocean blue. For the Chinese, the last 500 years of European
and American ascendancy in the world is just a hiccup of history, and
now they are preparing to resume their rightful
place in the sun, as they see it.
Post by Don Ocean
NAA hires 142,000 people to research and develope a system to
get men to the moon. Hundreds of $billions are spent.. Several
years of cutting edge research is accomplished! Thousands of
inventions from small to massive brakthroughs are developed in
this team effort.. Of course the inventions and the technology
belong to the American taxpayer.. They paid for it! Does Werner
Von Braun take all the credit for his rocketry.. Nope! Not by a
long shot.<
He shouldn't, because most of the credit goes to John Goddard, the
American father of rocketry.Indeed,
when Americans first questioned the captured Germans about their V-2
technology, they replied "Why are you asking us? You should have
talked to John Goddard. We basically learned almost everything
following him."
Post by Don Ocean
One Jew pops up and says he is an Engineer that worked on
that project and that we never achieved that goal of getting to the
moon. Of the 21 of us that were there in that area..There was one
American Jew and he had a heart attack halfway through the project.
None of us have ever heard of this other fellow. So who do you
believe? 142,000 folks that put Apollo up or one Jew that nobody can
place. By the way the Jew that died was in Italy WWII and a fine fellow
excellent papers in Astrophysics.. But he was a *TEAM* member... Just
as was the handful of Jews that serve on the huge manpower team of
the Manhattan project. Hell, You probably think that even Sandia is
part of Israel! My God...Do you really think that nobody can get along
or invent/develope things without a Jewish hand in it.. Serbians
Marisa Einstien and Nicola Testla actually did most of what Jews like
to take credit for. Even your best Jewish Scientists studied at the
knee of German professors at the Suis Teknikal Akademy. The best
codebrakers in the world were non-Jew brits.. Yet I hear amazing
claims of how the Jews did it.. Give it a break Buz! Some Jews have
fine minds and actually use them for good.. But keep in mind...So do
Gentiles of many nations.. Open a book of the breakthroughs in
Science
Post by Don Ocean
etc through the Centuries and see for you self! We knew about the
amazing atom since the 1800's and earlier. The bible for Laser
science
Post by Don Ocean
was written in 1924.. long before we developed the hardware to build
one. MIT wrote the Radlab series(a complete research of Microwaves)
during WWII. We are still developing things from that set of books.
Magnetics and high voltage go back to Maxwell, Planck, Oerstead,
Testla and dozens of others.. We are still developing items from the
research in the 1700's and the 1800's. Even a Canadian hired gun worked
out a magnetic cannon for Iraq.. Sadly the Jews assassinated him instead
of just stopping him. I wonder how much knowledge was either stolen or
eliminated by those assassins?<
Hey, I agree with most of what you just wrote! But we were talking
about nuclear physics, and not
rocketry, or chemisty or most other fields where Jewish contribution
was ancillary at best. IN the early days of theoretical physics, Jewish
thinkers were amonst the foremost groundbreakers. I'm not one of those
chauvinistic xenophobes that claims Jews to be central to everything
that ever happened in history. The JEwish contribution to most things
was mostly accidental, because JEws (as earlier Pheonicians and Greeks)
were dispersed amongst many nations, and became mercantile and not a
peasantry tied to one spot, and hence they became uniquely positioned
to learn a lot from many other
civilizations, and then to contribute back a fair amount in return. Now
that ISrael exists again, itscontributions are fairly modest compared
to the past, because the people are once again tied to a small country
and are engaged in farming and industry and other things besides
mercantile activities and learning, and so the Jewish contribution is
"downsized" accordingly. It's not innate. It's all about education,
getting around, and learning from others and not being tied down. A
merchant in one sale can often make more than a worker or peasant in a
day or even week's work, and so he might have the time and money to
learn or send his kids to school to learn.That's the whole "secret" of
the Jews in a nutshell.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
We were well aware of Atomic reactions since the 1800's.<
The theory of the atomic nature of matter hardly existed until well
late in the 1880s. And Einstein's famous 1905 equation equating mass
and energy (E=mc^2)
That was Mrs Einstein(A Serbian) and was developed a year or 2 before
she met Einstein.<
I admire the Serbs, incuding Tesla and Mrs. Einstein who was badly
treated by him, because he was a typical free-thinking liberal Jew, and
they are irresponsible troublemakers. Nonetheless, he was a good
physicist, but indeed she may have contributed a lot more than he
acknowledged. I saw the documentary too. All great thinkers synthesize
information and stand on the shoulders of others, and Einstein was no
exception. Nonetheless, he gets the lion's share of credit for the
final product.

. When Einstein dumped his wife and daughter..He stated
Post by Don Ocean
flatly that he had never met an uglier woman.. So you tell me... What
was his motives in marrying her. <
He wanted to get laid. It happens to lots of people. In personal life,
he was a scumbag, like most humans.
Post by Don Ocean
He got the Nobel prize, but she
demanded and got the money after she agreed never to expose
him(FACT!)
Post by Don Ocean
That Theory was developed by her with an elderly physics professor
at the Suise Akademy!<
He gave her the money from the prize to raise his kids alone, and I
don't know if she shook him down for
it. He just couldn't be a "family man" and needed someone else who did
not make demands on his time
and emotions. It happens in life to many people. Not nice, but it
happens.
Post by Don Ocean
was the first insight into the amount and
Post by j***@netzero.com
possibiity of changing mass directly into energy since the time of
medieval alchemists, and Leo Szilard was the first to imagine (and
patent in England)
how a nuclear chain reaction could be made possible,
Post by j***@netzero.com
and how to control it.
Actually the first reaction was a bedspring reaction at Columbia
Universities Squash court. And Lizard naysayed it..saying it would
react with all atoms and possibly destroy the earth. By the way
that squash court is now a rose Garden and still hot!
You are aware of the thousands that worked on that project.<
No I am not. I would like to know more, if you have a reference or
website I can learn about it.
Post by Don Ocean
It is true that the Germans first actually split
Post by j***@netzero.com
the atom in 1939, but that is exactly the event that made Szilard round
up Einstein in Princeton, and got Edward Teller to chauffeur the both
of them to see FDR, to persuade him to start a nuclear program. With
the generous $6,000 that Roosevelt gave Szilard, he called in his
Italian mechanic, Enrico Fermi,
I understand Fermi was already teaching in America due to his
Antifacist
Post by Don Ocean
stand in Italy... Nice try.. And Fermi was not all Jewish. Cripes
Where do you get this garbage.
from Italy to join him in Columbia
Post by j***@netzero.com
university (in Manhattan, hence "Manhattan Project," and they went on
from there to the University of Chicao to build the first little
functioning graphite-based nuclear reactor - the very first nuclear
reactor in history. Hence the theory
I already pooh poohed that... it was at Columbia!<
It started in Columbia, as I too wrote. But the first functioning
reactor was in Chicago, built by Fermi
and Szilard.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
was confirmed. From there to a bomb I admit required a helluva lot of
good engineering.The Germans gave up on graphite, but Szilard insisted,
and Szilard proved right, which is why the US got a quantum leap over
Germany towards an atomic bomb. As for practical bomb technology
itself, that was a different matter and
I agree that Jews were less involved in the engineering, except for
maybe Oppenheimer the director of the
entire bomb project. I don't know much about the nuts and bolts part.
I leave that to the nuts and the dolts :)
I and thousands of others have the capabilities to produce such..With
oodles of money and help.. It is no longer out of reach of the
average
Post by Don Ocean
high school student!<
Sure NOW! EVerything is easy once you know HOW. Remember the story
about COlumbus and
standing an egg on end. Easy once you know how.
Post by Don Ocean
Only the first detonators were edgy and crude.
Very easy to put together a detonator today. Just lots of money and
access to certain element etc. Logistics and safety of personal are the
prime problems now. The materials no longer need to be refined. They are
refined as part of the reaction.. Quite cheap in comparison with
yesterdays nukes.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
Germanys heavy water research and race to develope a
bomb is what motivated America to invest heavily and steal the fire
from Germany. <
You are so ass-backwards you've GOT to be an Arab! The Germans turned
to heavy water because they
gave up on graphite. But when graphite did not work well in the US,
Szilard insisted that it wasn't pure enough.
The Germans believe deeply in their own test instruments; Szilard
believed deeply in his own brain. He won.
Germany lost the race because the Jews stole their technology <
How did "the JEws" do that? With a gun or a machete?
Post by Don Ocean
and
Anerica and England Bombed their researchers into dust. Von Braun
for instance(Rocketry) was a Jr Scientist, But the most senior
survivor!
Post by Don Ocean
Is it so hard for you as a jew to give Germany the credit it
deserves.<

Germany deserves a lot of credit, but without their Jews, they lost and
America won, with some help from German Jews.
Post by Don Ocean
When was the last time that a bunch of Jews got together and built
universities of higher learning that are renowned worldwide?
Germany, Switzerland, America, and England did! Jews became the
students...<
True. But the Weitzmann Institute and Technion in Israel aren't bad.
The bigger and richer the country, the more and better technology it
can afford. INdian science and technical schools are now among the
world's best.
Post by Don Ocean
And now the students want the credit for what they were
taught. Fah!! You people will never change.. The greed covers
everything from knowledge to money.<
It's not what you learn, but what you can do with it that counts.
Clearly I can't do much, or I wouldn't be here "talking" to you :)
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
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The only real information furnished by Jews was by
EnricoFermi(Italian Jew)<
Fermi was not a Jew. His wife was. He left Italy because of the race
laws that Mussolini was forced to implement by Nazi dictate. He joined
Szilard in Columbia university in Manhattan (hence the name
"Manhattan
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Project"), and then went with hiim to build the reactor in the U of
Chicago. Szilard did most of the thinking and Fermi did most of the
building.
I wish you would make up your mind how and why Enrico was here.. And
yes Enrico was part Jew...That is how he married an orthodox Jewess.
Damned.. Your thicker then a Demopcrat! ;--p0<
So maybe he had a Jewish father or grandparent, I don't know. Doesn't
make him a Jew by our Jewish law, but maybe by your Nuremberg Racial
laws.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
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He came up with the detonating devices after
heavy reading of German technical papers stolen by our friends the
Brits. At Columbia university there were thousands of Scientist and
Mathematicians...and a few Jews.. Now typical of all Jews...They now
claim to have invented even oxygen..<
No, the discovery of oxygen was by a Frenchman.
Wow! I was sure that you were going to claim ownership of it
because a Jew invented it! By the way discovering and inventing are
2 different things.. Its like Columbus claimed to have discovered and
claimed America.. Eric the Red had been here hundreds of years
earlier
Post by Don Ocean
and America already had a population in ownership! Plus the fact that
Columbus never got near modern day America.<
Thanks for clarifying that distinction. I would never have guessed :)
Post by Don Ocean
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Well Asshole America spent Billions
and used thousands of the finest brains in the world to develope
that.<
The finest brains in the world then were Jewish. All the billions spent
on mediocre brains don't yield much, which is why neither the Germans,
Japanese
nor Russians beat America to the bomb. It was thanks to Jewish
brains coming to America that put the US into first place.
I guess Hitler was stoking the fires with the brightest that were too
dumb to haul ass when he warned them in 1933. By the way the highest
scores at MENSA are Russian and German.. I don't hold much truk with
that...But you insist on insulting this ole country boys 3rd grade
education! ;-p
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
The real contribution to world nuclear devices was the Rosenburgs.
Typical of Jews ..They promptly sold us out to the Russians.<
Since Jews invented it, they can give it to anyone they want.
That attitude is why I am pushing for execution of any Jew that
crosses America.. In fact I am pushing for all Jews with even a snuffle
of Israel to be expelled promptly for the good of the nation..
J Edgar Hoover had you peopl;e right!<
I used to admire that cross-dressing faggot too at one time.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Your interpretatoin of history is as stupid as you are. EInstein
predicted nuclear energy, and Szilard and Fermi made it happen.
Oppenheimer was the head of the project, and later Ed Teller, another
Hungarian Jew, became father of the US H-bomb. And Admiral
Rickover,
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
another JEw,
I admire Rickover...He demanded that we do something about Israel
attacking the USS Liberty as did another all-American Jew..Barry
GoldWater.. MCNamara over-ruled that! Rickover did a fine job
of being a manager of the people that developed the nuclear
submarine fleet... He had absolutely nothing to do with the
Nautilus and the first nuke boats.. And nothing to do with the
surface fleet. I met the little fuck in Groton Connecticut years
back.. He was alright. But the overall technaical aspects were
think tanks and team efforts... Jews did not prevail ...Except in your
greedy grubby mind. Ummm? If Jews are the brains of the earth...Why are
you wasting time with me... Why ain't you out inventing a cage to
capture a flying saucer or something..<
Well, all of those who deny the Holocaust seem to believe in UFOs. Why
doesn't one of y'all capture
a flying saucer? Maybe my grandmother is still in it.
Post by Don Ocean
Your probably into literature or
art<
No. I'm a Philistine and hate art and literature.
Post by Don Ocean
. Cuase you sure as hell are in the dark on the Sciences,,,<
I'm not a scientist. I was once a technical writer and hence hung
around some engineers and programmers, many in Israel. Studied a little
electronics in my day. That's about it.
Post by Don Ocean
Just the opinion of a poor ole country boy that never bin out in the
real Jewish world! ;-p<
Never "bin" in your world either. I'm not a heavy drinker, and beer
hall fights don't make my day.
Post by Don Ocean
was the father of the nuclear submarine navy. But you are
Post by j***@netzero.com
correct that Jews gave it to both the US and Russia.
Hope that I never get into power... I will eliminate the
danger that you people present to the world.. Could it be
that Hitler had it right and we fucked up a good thing.
Damned that Satan!!!!<
You are hardly the only "real American" that really had his heart with
the Nazis in WWII while fighting
them in the Bulge. Patton was a well known Nazi sympathizer all along.
Well, it's in the blood. They's
yore people, after all. I mean, there's probably a gene for genocide of
Jews, American Indians, etc.
We Jews called them "Amalekites" in the bible and were forewarned that
they would try to exterminate us in every generation. But it doesn't
bother me in the slightest. As long as "my" people have some guns and
nukes too, I don't worry about it a whole lot anymore. They're only
efficient at killing UNARMED Jews.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
probably another 100,000 or more American GIs
Post by j***@netzero.com
would be laying dead in the soil of Japan right now.
Actaully that is possible...But there was also a plan to starve them
out
Post by j***@netzero.com
of Japan.<
That would have taken a long time. Japanese are very industrious and
parsimonious.
Shows how little you know of that Island empire.
Post by j***@netzero.com
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Post by Don Ocean
And we are not at war in Iraq. We are in a
terrorist insurgency and are now only backing up the Iraqi police
and military.<
Well, "we" were technically not at war in Korea or in Vietnam
either.
Don't make any difference what the pols say.. When your in a shooting
match... It is war!
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
The US refuses to lose any more wars, which is why it doesn't
declare
Post by j***@netzero.com
war anymore :) If the US wants to win a war, it has to use atomic
bombs, unless you count little conflicts like the first Gulf War.
Not really...We do have things more horrific then nuclear!<
Yeah, you :)
Biological keeps giving for Centuries and more.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
You have noticed the sad losses of many Iraqi police
and military? And if we send more troops... How about we also
squash that shithole that started this stuff in the first
palce...Israel!!!<
Yeah, go quit Iraq and take on ISrael.Sure, why not? How about
practicing on North Korea first? They only have six atomic bombs.
Actually none of the above is scary... A walk in the park if the
word is given for a real war with no limits on us. We could have
smoked
Post by j***@netzero.com
both Korea and VietNam if the Rules of engagement were not skewed by
idiots.<
I agree with you. Had MacArthur nuked the Chinese on the other side of
the Yalu in 1950, none of the rest since then would have happened. Not
Vietnam, not the Cuban crisis, nada had the commies learned early on
that the US will nuke any aggressor anywhere. But I agree, that
bleeding heart leftist Jewish liberals did keep the Cold War going for
decades because of their leftist leanings. But many of them, myself
included, subesequently having seen the light became "neocons." But
now, you American Nazi types are now critical of right wing Jews. The
simple fact is, your type should have gone to Germany in 1940 and
fought on the side you believed in then, and now. Any side the Jew wil
take will be the side you're against no matter what.
Most of those idiot by the way were Jews. Kissinger and
Post by j***@netzero.com
McNamara <
McNamara was a Jew? News to me. But who knows? Apparently lots of Irish
are becoming Jews lately.<
Don Ocean
2005-05-06 23:29:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
The figure I've always heard was half a million. Fifteen million
non-JEws, which then was ten percent of the
If that were true...We would have had Jewish divisions such as we
had Japanese divisions.. <
We (the US) made Japanese units out of those volunteers we interned,
because they wanted to prove themselves, and they certainly did, and
because we wanted to keep them together to keep an eye on them.
Post by Don Ocean
Very few Jews fought in the pacific. Most Jews
fought or whatever in Italy and foreward. <
You may be right. American Jews were concerned about the Germans
murdering their families in Europe, and not about the Japanese. It's
the Chinese who were getting slaughtered by them.
Actuall my source is
Post by Don Ocean
Colliers facts and whatever of WWII.. Probably edited by a Jew..
Post by j***@netzero.com
population, and half million Jews or 10% of the American Jewish
population. Which book is the source of your figures again?
As for most Jews having to be drafted, that may be so.
Where I live...They sent folks back home to wait for their enlistment
to be numbered. They only had so many uniforms and training camps.
Omaha was swamped with would be enlisters. Our farms were were
left with women old men and children..plus 4F'ers.. Not a lot of
4F'rs here though. They actually signed waivers or lied to get in.
Jack Elbey signed a waiver and hoined with one eye.. Didn't need to
go.<
Hey, what else is there when you're from the farm? :) But seriously, I
agree that the Jews who did eagerly enlist in WWII were concerned about
JEws in Europe getting killed, and less about other reasons for the
war. They were less concerned about the millions of Chinese being
slaughtered by the Japanese, or Ukrainians being collectivized and
starved by Stalin, but mainly concerned about their own. Ethnicity is a
strong force, but Leftist Jews never wanted to admit to it. I do admit
to it. Gentiles basically don't care about what happened to the Jews,
and vice versa. I try to be more honest about it. People care most
about "their own" - their own family, their own clan, their own tribe,
their own ethnicity, "breed," etc. It's a fact of life. Liberal Jews
are hypocrites, but most can't admit to it.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
I don't know. Most GEntile Americans had to be drafted too. In all
the
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
wars up to and including WWII, American Jews generally went to war
in
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
the same proportion as the rest of the population. This changed
when
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
college students were exempted from the draft, as in Vietnam.
I noticed the strife on campus...So that was Jewish inspired too? I
should have guessed.<
A lot of it was. As for myself, I was more intellectual about it even
then.One of the first things I remembered as a kid on TV was watching
the surrounding and capture of the French Foreign Legion at
Dienbienphu in 1954, and later on, read books by Bernard Fall about
the Indonchinese war. So, despite helicopters and all, I didn't see
where the US would succeed where the French had failed earlier on. But
much later on, after the war, I realized much better that indeed that
Ho Chi Minh indeed was a commie, and despite all of the talk of a
nationalist civil war, etc., the simple fact was that it was indeed
communist subversion of South Vietnam, but I didn't think we could win
it using conventional means, and
unless we used a nuke on Hanoi, it would all be a waste of American
lives in any case. We can win any conventional war against a
conventional army, but cannot against guerrillas and terrorists because
our democratic televised media will never let use the horrible means
needed to subdue terrorists. We did it in the Phillippines in the
1920s, but there were no TV cameras to show what American troops had to
do
to put down the Filipinos, and the 300,000 deaths we incurred on them.
I realised that with TV cameras we could never win a guerrilla terror
war, so Vietnam was a bloody exercise in futility, and only made
vets like you bitter. And rightly so, because if you go into war, you
have to do what you have to do to win, or get out.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
but most of the really tough fighting was done by the Russians
and the Chinese,<
Yep! no argument there.. And done with American logistics and
lendlease.<
I know. My father was fought from Leninigrad to Berlin and killed a
few
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Nazis on the way.
Post by j***@netzero.com
both of whom lost 20 million each. But the US forces
definitely did tip the balance against the Axis. THe role of the
Chinese in tying down 60%
...> Anyhow, if the JEws hadn't given the US the edge in getting
Post by j***@netzero.com
the atomic bomb first,
The Jews were paid hired hands and not one fucking Jew invented
cutting edge technology..<
Bullshit. Jews practically invented nuclear physics.
You better research that a bit better. WQhy is the Jews are
so anally Retentive that they must claim credit for everything
and that everything of value belongs to them?<
For the same reasons many Americans think they invented the whole world
:) EVen today Americans forget that Imperial China was the greatest,
richest, and most advanced power on earth decades before Columbus
sailed the ocean blue. For the Chinese, the last 500 years of European
and American ascendancy in the world is just a hiccup of history, and
now they are preparing to resume their rightful
place in the sun, as they see it.
Post by Don Ocean
NAA hires 142,000 people to research and develope a system to
get men to the moon. Hundreds of $billions are spent.. Several
years of cutting edge research is accomplished! Thousands of
inventions from small to massive brakthroughs are developed in
this team effort.. Of course the inventions and the technology
belong to the American taxpayer.. They paid for it! Does Werner
Von Braun take all the credit for his rocketry.. Nope! Not by a
long shot.<
He shouldn't, because most of the credit goes to John Goddard, the
American father of rocketry.Indeed,
when Americans first questioned the captured Germans about their V-2
technology, they replied "Why are you asking us? You should have
talked to John Goddard. We basically learned almost everything
following him."
Post by Don Ocean
One Jew pops up and says he is an Engineer that worked on
that project and that we never achieved that goal of getting to the
moon. Of the 21 of us that were there in that area..There was one
American Jew and he had a heart attack halfway through the project.
None of us have ever heard of this other fellow. So who do you
believe? 142,000 folks that put Apollo up or one Jew that nobody can
place. By the way the Jew that died was in Italy WWII and a fine
fellow
Post by Don Ocean
excellent papers in Astrophysics.. But he was a *TEAM* member... Just
as was the handful of Jews that serve on the huge manpower team of
the Manhattan project. Hell, You probably think that even Sandia is
part of Israel! My God...Do you really think that nobody can get
along
Post by Don Ocean
or invent/develope things without a Jewish hand in it.. Serbians
Marisa Einstien and Nicola Testla actually did most of what Jews like
to take credit for. Even your best Jewish Scientists studied at the
knee of German professors at the Suis Teknikal Akademy. The best
codebrakers in the world were non-Jew brits.. Yet I hear amazing
claims of how the Jews did it.. Give it a break Buz! Some Jews have
fine minds and actually use them for good.. But keep in mind...So do
Gentiles of many nations.. Open a book of the breakthroughs in
Science
Post by Don Ocean
etc through the Centuries and see for you self! We knew about the
amazing atom since the 1800's and earlier. The bible for Laser
science
Post by Don Ocean
was written in 1924.. long before we developed the hardware to build
one. MIT wrote the Radlab series(a complete research of Microwaves)
during WWII. We are still developing things from that set of books.
Magnetics and high voltage go back to Maxwell, Planck, Oerstead,
Testla and dozens of others.. We are still developing items from the
research in the 1700's and the 1800's. Even a Canadian hired gun
worked
Post by Don Ocean
out a magnetic cannon for Iraq.. Sadly the Jews assassinated him
instead
Post by Don Ocean
of just stopping him. I wonder how much knowledge was either stolen
or
Post by Don Ocean
eliminated by those assassins?<
Hey, I agree with most of what you just wrote! But we were talking
about nuclear physics, and not
rocketry, or chemisty or most other fields where Jewish contribution
was ancillary at best. IN the early days of theoretical physics, Jewish
thinkers were amonst the foremost groundbreakers. I'm not one of those
chauvinistic xenophobes that claims Jews to be central to everything
that ever happened in history. The JEwish contribution to most things
was mostly accidental, because JEws (as earlier Pheonicians and Greeks)
were dispersed amongst many nations, and became mercantile and not a
peasantry tied to one spot, and hence they became uniquely positioned
to learn a lot from many other
civilizations, and then to contribute back a fair amount in return. Now
that ISrael exists again, itscontributions are fairly modest compared
to the past, because the people are once again tied to a small country
and are engaged in farming and industry and other things besides
mercantile activities and learning, and so the Jewish contribution is
"downsized" accordingly. It's not innate. It's all about education,
getting around, and learning from others and not being tied down. A
merchant in one sale can often make more than a worker or peasant in a
day or even week's work, and so he might have the time and money to
learn or send his kids to school to learn.That's the whole "secret" of
the Jews in a nutshell.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
We were well aware of Atomic reactions since the 1800's.<
The theory of the atomic nature of matter hardly existed until
well
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
late in the 1880s. And Einstein's famous 1905 equation equating
mass
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
and energy (E=mc^2)
That was Mrs Einstein(A Serbian) and was developed a year or 2 before
she met Einstein.<
I admire the Serbs, incuding Tesla and Mrs. Einstein who was badly
treated by him, because he was a typical free-thinking liberal Jew, and
they are irresponsible troublemakers. Nonetheless, he was a good
physicist, but indeed she may have contributed a lot more than he
acknowledged. I saw the documentary too. All great thinkers synthesize
information and stand on the shoulders of others, and Einstein was no
exception. Nonetheless, he gets the lion's share of credit for the
final product.
. When Einstein dumped his wife and daughter..He stated
Post by Don Ocean
flatly that he had never met an uglier woman.. So you tell me... What
was his motives in marrying her. <
He wanted to get laid. It happens to lots of people. In personal life,
he was a scumbag, like most humans.
Post by Don Ocean
He got the Nobel prize, but she
demanded and got the money after she agreed never to expose
him(FACT!)
Post by Don Ocean
That Theory was developed by her with an elderly physics professor
at the Suise Akademy!<
He gave her the money from the prize to raise his kids alone, and I
don't know if she shook him down for
it. He just couldn't be a "family man" and needed someone else who did
not make demands on his time
and emotions. It happens in life to many people. Not nice, but it
happens.
Post by Don Ocean
was the first insight into the amount and
Post by j***@netzero.com
possibiity of changing mass directly into energy since the time of
medieval alchemists, and Leo Szilard was the first to imagine (and
patent in England)
how a nuclear chain reaction could be made possible,
Post by j***@netzero.com
and how to control it.
Actually the first reaction was a bedspring reaction at Columbia
Universities Squash court. And Lizard naysayed it..saying it would
react with all atoms and possibly destroy the earth. By the way
that squash court is now a rose Garden and still hot!
You are aware of the thousands that worked on that project.<
No I am not. I would like to know more, if you have a reference or
website I can learn about it.
There is an archive on it at Sandia... I am sure Columbia has one also
and I am sure fully researching the manhattan project on Google will do
it.. I wrote a research addendum on it years ago ..actually copied from
the Library of Congress... and the Wartime budget papers also have
some interesting takes or disclosures. None of that stuff was ever
classified.. ?????? I can't tremember the Army bigshot that ran that
project... But someone wrote a book on it ..Which was quite good and
factual for a change.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
It is true that the Germans first actually split
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the atom in 1939, but that is exactly the event that made Szilard
round
Post by Don Ocean
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up Einstein in Princeton, and got Edward Teller to chauffeur the
both
Post by Don Ocean
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of them to see FDR, to persuade him to start a nuclear program.
With
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
the generous $6,000 that Roosevelt gave Szilard, he called in his
Italian mechanic, Enrico Fermi,
I understand Fermi was already teaching in America due to his
Antifacist
Post by Don Ocean
stand in Italy... Nice try.. And Fermi was not all Jewish. Cripes
Where do you get this garbage.
from Italy to join him in Columbia
Post by j***@netzero.com
university (in Manhattan, hence "Manhattan Project," and they went
on
Post by Don Ocean
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from there to the University of Chicao to build the first little
functioning graphite-based nuclear reactor - the very first nuclear
reactor in history. Hence the theory
I already pooh poohed that... it was at Columbia!<
It started in Columbia, as I too wrote. But the first functioning
reactor was in Chicago, built by Fermi
and Szilard.
Post by Don Ocean
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was confirmed. From there to a bomb I admit required a helluva lot
of
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good engineering.The Germans gave up on graphite, but Szilard
insisted,
Post by Don Ocean
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and Szilard proved right, which is why the US got a quantum leap
over
Post by Don Ocean
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Germany towards an atomic bomb. As for practical bomb technology
itself, that was a different matter and
I agree that Jews were less involved in the engineering, except
for
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
maybe Oppenheimer the director of the
entire bomb project. I don't know much about the nuts and bolts
part.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
I leave that to the nuts and the dolts :)
I and thousands of others have the capabilities to produce such..With
oodles of money and help.. It is no longer out of reach of the
average
Post by Don Ocean
high school student!<
Sure NOW! EVerything is easy once you know HOW. Remember the story
about COlumbus and
standing an egg on end. Easy once you know how.
Post by Don Ocean
Only the first detonators were edgy and crude.
Very easy to put together a detonator today. Just lots of money and
access to certain element etc. Logistics and safety of personal are
the
Post by Don Ocean
prime problems now. The materials no longer need to be refined. They
are
Post by Don Ocean
refined as part of the reaction.. Quite cheap in comparison with
yesterdays nukes.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
Germanys heavy water research and race to develope a
bomb is what motivated America to invest heavily and steal the fire
from Germany. <
You are so ass-backwards you've GOT to be an Arab! The Germans
turned
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
to heavy water because they
gave up on graphite. But when graphite did not work well in the US,
Szilard insisted that it wasn't pure enough.
The Germans believe deeply in their own test instruments; Szilard
believed deeply in his own brain. He won.
Germany lost the race because the Jews stole their technology <
How did "the JEws" do that? With a gun or a machete?
Post by Don Ocean
and
Anerica and England Bombed their researchers into dust. Von Braun
for instance(Rocketry) was a Jr Scientist, But the most senior
survivor!
Post by Don Ocean
Is it so hard for you as a jew to give Germany the credit it
deserves.<
Germany deserves a lot of credit, but without their Jews, they lost and
America won, with some help from German Jews.
Post by Don Ocean
When was the last time that a bunch of Jews got together and built
universities of higher learning that are renowned worldwide?
Germany, Switzerland, America, and England did! Jews became the
students...<
True. But the Weitzmann Institute and Technion in Israel aren't bad.
The bigger and richer the country, the more and better technology it
can afford. INdian science and technical schools are now among the
world's best.
Post by Don Ocean
And now the students want the credit for what they were
taught. Fah!! You people will never change.. The greed covers
everything from knowledge to money.<
It's not what you learn, but what you can do with it that counts.
Clearly I can't do much, or I wouldn't be here "talking" to you :)
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
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The only real information furnished by Jews was by
EnricoFermi(Italian Jew)<
Fermi was not a Jew. His wife was. He left Italy because of the
race
Post by Don Ocean
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laws that Mussolini was forced to implement by Nazi dictate. He
joined
Post by Don Ocean
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Szilard in Columbia university in Manhattan (hence the name
"Manhattan
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Project"), and then went with hiim to build the reactor in the U of
Chicago. Szilard did most of the thinking and Fermi did most of the
building.
I wish you would make up your mind how and why Enrico was here.. And
yes Enrico was part Jew...That is how he married an orthodox Jewess.
Damned.. Your thicker then a Demopcrat! ;--p0<
So maybe he had a Jewish father or grandparent, I don't know. Doesn't
make him a Jew by our Jewish law, but maybe by your Nuremberg Racial
laws.
Post by Don Ocean
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He came up with the detonating devices after
heavy reading of German technical papers stolen by our friends the
Brits. At Columbia university there were thousands of Scientist and
Mathematicians...and a few Jews.. Now typical of all Jews...They
now
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
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claim to have invented even oxygen..<
No, the discovery of oxygen was by a Frenchman.
Wow! I was sure that you were going to claim ownership of it
because a Jew invented it! By the way discovering and inventing are
2 different things.. Its like Columbus claimed to have discovered and
claimed America.. Eric the Red had been here hundreds of years
earlier
Post by Don Ocean
and America already had a population in ownership! Plus the fact that
Columbus never got near modern day America.<
Thanks for clarifying that distinction. I would never have guessed :)
Post by Don Ocean
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Well Asshole America spent Billions
and used thousands of the finest brains in the world to develope
that.<
The finest brains in the world then were Jewish. All the billions
spent
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
on mediocre brains don't yield much, which is why neither the
Germans,
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Japanese
nor Russians beat America to the bomb. It was thanks to Jewish
brains coming to America that put the US into first place.
I guess Hitler was stoking the fires with the brightest that were too
dumb to haul ass when he warned them in 1933. By the way the highest
scores at MENSA are Russian and German.. I don't hold much truk with
that...But you insist on insulting this ole country boys 3rd grade
education! ;-p
Post by j***@netzero.com
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The real contribution to world nuclear devices was the Rosenburgs.
Typical of Jews ..They promptly sold us out to the Russians.<
Since Jews invented it, they can give it to anyone they want.
That attitude is why I am pushing for execution of any Jew that
crosses America.. In fact I am pushing for all Jews with even a
snuffle
Post by Don Ocean
of Israel to be expelled promptly for the good of the nation..
J Edgar Hoover had you peopl;e right!<
I used to admire that cross-dressing faggot too at one time.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Your interpretatoin of history is as stupid as you are. EInstein
predicted nuclear energy, and Szilard and Fermi made it happen.
Oppenheimer was the head of the project, and later Ed Teller,
another
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
Hungarian Jew, became father of the US H-bomb. And Admiral
Rickover,
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
another JEw,
I admire Rickover...He demanded that we do something about Israel
attacking the USS Liberty as did another all-American Jew..Barry
GoldWater.. MCNamara over-ruled that! Rickover did a fine job
of being a manager of the people that developed the nuclear
submarine fleet... He had absolutely nothing to do with the
Nautilus and the first nuke boats.. And nothing to do with the
surface fleet. I met the little fuck in Groton Connecticut years
back.. He was alright. But the overall technaical aspects were
think tanks and team efforts... Jews did not prevail ...Except in
your
Post by Don Ocean
greedy grubby mind. Ummm? If Jews are the brains of the earth...Why
are
Post by Don Ocean
you wasting time with me... Why ain't you out inventing a cage to
capture a flying saucer or something..<
Well, all of those who deny the Holocaust seem to believe in UFOs. Why
doesn't one of y'all capture
a flying saucer? Maybe my grandmother is still in it.
Post by Don Ocean
Your probably into literature or
art<
No. I'm a Philistine and hate art and literature.
Post by Don Ocean
. Cuase you sure as hell are in the dark on the Sciences,,,<
I'm not a scientist. I was once a technical writer and hence hung
around some engineers and programmers, many in Israel. Studied a little
electronics in my day. That's about it.
Post by Don Ocean
Just the opinion of a poor ole country boy that never bin out in the
real Jewish world! ;-p<
Never "bin" in your world either. I'm not a heavy drinker, and beer
hall fights don't make my day.
Post by Don Ocean
was the father of the nuclear submarine navy. But you are
Post by j***@netzero.com
correct that Jews gave it to both the US and Russia.
Hope that I never get into power... I will eliminate the
danger that you people present to the world.. Could it be
that Hitler had it right and we fucked up a good thing.
Damned that Satan!!!!<
You are hardly the only "real American" that really had his heart with
the Nazis in WWII while fighting
them in the Bulge. Patton was a well known Nazi sympathizer all along.
Well, it's in the blood. They's
yore people, after all. I mean, there's probably a gene for genocide of
Jews, American Indians, etc.
We Jews called them "Amalekites" in the bible and were forewarned that
they would try to exterminate us in every generation. But it doesn't
bother me in the slightest. As long as "my" people have some guns and
nukes too, I don't worry about it a whole lot anymore. They're only
efficient at killing UNARMED Jews.
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
probably another 100,000 or more American GIs
Post by j***@netzero.com
would be laying dead in the soil of Japan right now.
Actaully that is possible...But there was also a plan to starve
them
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
out
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of Japan.<
That would have taken a long time. Japanese are very industrious
and
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
parsimonious.
Shows how little you know of that Island empire.
Post by j***@netzero.com
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Post by Don Ocean
And we are not at war in Iraq. We are in a
terrorist insurgency and are now only backing up the Iraqi police
and military.<
Well, "we" were technically not at war in Korea or in Vietnam
either.
Don't make any difference what the pols say.. When your in a shooting
match... It is war!
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
The US refuses to lose any more wars, which is why it doesn't
declare
Post by j***@netzero.com
war anymore :) If the US wants to win a war, it has to use atomic
bombs, unless you count little conflicts like the first Gulf War.
Not really...We do have things more horrific then nuclear!<
Yeah, you :)
Biological keeps giving for Centuries and more.
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by j***@netzero.com
Post by Don Ocean
You have noticed the sad losses of many Iraqi police
and military? And if we send more troops... How about we also
squash that shithole that started this stuff in the first
palce...Israel!!!<
Yeah, go quit Iraq and take on ISrael.Sure, why not? How about
practicing on North Korea first? They only have six atomic bombs.
Actually none of the above is scary... A walk in the park if the
word is given for a real war with no limits on us. We could have
smoked
Post by j***@netzero.com
both Korea and VietNam if the Rules of engagement were not skewed
by
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
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idiots.<
I agree with you. Had MacArthur nuked the Chinese on the other side
of
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
the Yalu in 1950, none of the rest since then would have happened.
Not
Post by Don Ocean
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Vietnam, not the Cuban crisis, nada had the commies learned early
on
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
that the US will nuke any aggressor anywhere. But I agree, that
bleeding heart leftist Jewish liberals did keep the Cold War going
for
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
decades because of their leftist leanings. But many of them, myself
included, subesequently having seen the light became "neocons."
But
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
now, you American Nazi types are now critical of right wing Jews.
The
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
simple fact is, your type should have gone to Germany in 1940 and
fought on the side you believed in then, and now. Any side the Jew
wil
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
take will be the side you're against no matter what.
Most of those idiot by the way were Jews. Kissinger and
Post by j***@netzero.com
McNamara <
McNamara was a Jew? News to me. But who knows? Apparently lots of
Irish
Post by Don Ocean
Post by j***@netzero.com
are becoming Jews lately.<
Deborah Sharavi
2005-04-28 17:45:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Daniel Bernard
Shimon Peres doesn't like talking about the past. History, the Israeli
vice-premier and Labour party leader says, bores him. "I never think
back. Since I cannot change the past, why should I deal with it? You
have to really deal with the future," he said in an interview with the
Guardian.
What a load of shallow crap.
Post by Daniel Bernard
In the decade after the signing of
the 1993 Oslo accords, Israel doubled the size of Jewish settlements
in the West Bank.
So? Population grew. So did the Pallie population, which required
expansion of Pallie settlements.
Post by Daniel Bernard
"It seems the Israeli negotiations are on the basis of making peace
among themselves," said the Palestinian chief negotiator, Saeb Erekat.
"My analysis is that Mr Sharon is trying to cancel the third phase of
the road map that specifies Israel has to end the occupation and
negotiate the status of Jerusalem and refugees. Everything I see is
going in that direction."
Erekat sees "everything" that way, because Erekat is a confirmed liar.
Having been in on the negotiations with Israel, Erekat bloody well
knows that the Pallies agreed in September 1993 that:

1) Jerusalem would remain under Israeli control;
2) The PA would have no authority in Jerusalem;
3) Israeli "settlements" in Yesha and Gaza would remain
under Israeli rule;
4) There would be NO change in the status of Israeli "settlements" in
Yesha and Gaza.

Once again, Erekat proves that written agreements with the Pallies are
worthless.
Post by Daniel Bernard
The Palestinian leadership wants Israel to state clearly that the
final objective is a Palestinian state based on 1967 borders with East
Jerusalem as its capital
The Pallies agreed Israel would not return to the armistice lines of
1949 - Abba Eban's "Auschwitz borders". They further agreed that they
would have NO authority ANYWHERE in Jerusalem.
Post by Daniel Bernard
"I'm not sure. I think I would wait on the issue of Jerusalem ... and
also the issue of refugees. These are the two things that may prevent
us from having a majority for the time being," he said.
So-called "refugees" were likewise not mentioned in prior agreements.
Post by Daniel Bernard
Mr Erekat suspects that the reason Mr Sharon remains silent is
that he has no intention either of negotiating or of adhering to the
1967 borders. He believes that disengagement, along with the "security
fence" and continued settlement expansion, is part of the Israeli
prime minister's strategy to dictate the borders of a rump Palestinian
state.
Erekat would know. Rabin said time and again that Israel would never
return to the armistice lines of 1949. He also made it plain that while
he envisiaged autonomous Pallie areas, he never considered any Pallie
state. But, like the majority of Pallies, Erekat prefers lies to facts,
and once again proves that agreements with the Pallies have all the
substance of an agreement written on used toilet paper.

Deborah
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